Bart, I know what you're saying about it being a minor expense, but just like in real life, changes have to start with small steps. The government should be secular. It's only because it tips in favor of Christianity that it's acceptable...if it tipped toward Islam, I guarantee the citizenry would be up in arms about every penny. 8)
I'm actually on board with the whole separation between church and state. Didn't mean to make it sound like I wasn't, just in this case it seems a rather small issue comparatively. In a practical sense I don't think going after a scene while it's up trying to get it removed is necessary.
I think there's a more calm and rational way both sides could possibly agree perhaps the year after..yeah..let's not put this on public property.
I guess my issue doesn't stem with that as much as someone like Jetackuu who CLAIMS that's his reasoning, without wanting to admit that it stems from an opinion that religion is dumb. It is what it is.
I'm willing to concede on the public property thing being wrong in principle, again..just doesn't seem like the biggest issue. Something we should run around screaming and yelling because it's so appalling. I think we could tone it down, when it comes to these fights. I use to be such a fervent Athiest making fun of many Christians. It actually takes more understanding and tolerance than some people give it credit for, actually saying "hey. you beleive in Christ and that's ok.".
I would have it removed, it doesn't belong regardless of how "important" the matter may be to the individual.
Also I'm sorry that you doubt my reasons, but you're entitled to your opinion.
I still hold that faith doesn't deserve respect, on any level, but that has nothing to do with this. If I were saying they shouldn't have them at all in public view you would have a point (imo) but I just don't want them on public property, idc if you have one in the church yard, hell I implore them to do so, the more time churches waste time putting up scenes on their property the less they bother with other things.
Respect or no respect, religion has no place on public property (at least in the states) it needs to gtfo.
Sorry, incoming wall of text. I am not religious, but I celebrate as is family tradition. It's a chance to get everyone under the same roof at the same time and just enjoy each others company. I tell my parents every year to not buy me anything and they insist anyway(I'm 31). I understand that winter is a dreary, depressing time for a lot of people, and having a holiday like christmas gives people something to look forward to, to sort of counter the nothingness of winter. I get that much at least.
But, I hate the consumerist commercialized monster christmas has become. The stores in my town had christmas stock up BEFORE the halloween stuff! WTF!!!!
Add in the pressure and competitiveness of gift-giving, the unreachable standards people place upon those they demand gifts from, and whatever the hell religious message there was has flown the coup years ago. My little girl is 7 years old, and she has this OBSESSION with christmas. She was singing christmas carols in freaking October(when stores started putting out their holiday wares). We're not even a religious family. I think she actually prays to Santa. I wish I were kidding.
Something has to give. There has to be a boiling point. The christmas season starts earlier, and earlier, and earlier every year. Seriously, what other holiday gets it's own freaking season?
If it weren't for family tradition, I'd say screw the gifts, and just spend the holiday with the people you care about.
I don't celebrate Christmas personally because for the family with whom I celebrated most of my Christmas days, the gift giving was mostly self-indulgent. When I was younger and went to live with my father for a while, I didn't get anything (not even a card) from my grandparents with whom I've lived most of my life.
I talked to my brother about it later on to learn my grandmother had said "He is going to get everything he wants from your father." I got nothing that Christmas in actuality because my family I had went to live with was not doing well, but the thing that ruined Christmas for me was that if they couldn't hear me thanking them, it wasn't worth buying anything for me. So anything I got from them in the years since I haven't really cared to use.
I'm not anti-Christmas by any means. I just don't like Christmas when I'm around my family.
Sorry, incoming wall of text. I am not religious, but I celebrate as is family tradition. It's a chance to get everyone under the same roof at the same time and just enjoy each others company. I tell my parents every year to not buy me anything and they insist anyway(I'm 31). I understand that winter is a dreary, depressing time for a lot of people, and having a holiday like christmas gives people something to look forward to, to sort of counter the nothingness of winter. I get that much at least.
But, I hate the consumerist commercialized monster christmas has become. The stores in my town had christmas stock up BEFORE the halloween stuff! WTF!!!!
Add in the pressure and competitiveness of gift-giving, the unreachable standards people place upon those they demand gifts from, and whatever the hell religious message there was has flown the coup years ago. My little girl is 7 years old, and she has this OBSESSION with christmas. She was singing christmas carols in freaking October(when stores started putting out their holiday wares). We're not even a religious family. I think she actually prays to Santa. I wish I were kidding.
Something has to give. There has to be a boiling point. The christmas season starts earlier, and earlier, and earlier every year. Seriously, what other holiday gets it's own freaking season?
If it weren't for family tradition, I'd say screw the gifts, and just spend the holiday with the people you care about.
Black Appreciation Month(feb)
not a holiday but similar in disdain.
But yes I agree.
Xmas has gone overboard more and more every year.
hell comedy channels have "christmas in december" specials because of the overused "christmas in july" concept.
it's ridiculous.
this is how I kinda used to be ... thought Christmas was an overrated consumerist turned holiday which I still think it is... Although I rly disliked Christmas because of the step family i grew up with they would buy presents for my step brothers and sisters even our 2 dogs ... and leave my brother and I out of it just to sit and watch so I rly disliked holidays for that base reason among other things my brother and I got taken away from my mom 5 days before Christmas because my brothers dad wouldn't pay child support so because of that we were on welfare n food was scarce anywho end of that. despite all that bad crap since now I am an adult I have been able to make Christmas what i want it to be so now I have made it something enjoyable, the things i enjoy most are spending time with the people i care about and loved ones (in game and out of game) and seeing the joy and surprise in peoples faces when they open their gifts from me whether homemade or searched for n bought the other great thing is the awesome feeling when you cook a huge meal for everyone and they truly enjoy it ^___^ the feeling of appreciation is rly wuts awesome i was thinking about that the other day there isn't rly anything i WANT for Christmas this year lol I feel pretty blessed to have a great bf who plays ffxi with me and sincere wonderful friends in game and the small lil family that i do have appreciates and cares about me~ <3 so i wish and hope everyone have a great holiday or season or winter or w/e you celebrate or don't celebrate :3 love and peace <3 lol ^_^;
My husband and I don't celebrate Christmas but we do love a good julefrokost!
Maybe I worked in retail too long but I hate gift shopping. I would much prefer to make gifts or do soemthing with my friends and family, make memories. Why do we have to keep giving "stuff" to each other?
Happy Holidays all! Drink, dance and have fun during the coldest/darkest days of the year!
If belittling my belief in Jesus is how you demonstrate the tolerance and moral superiority of your ideology then you truly are no better then the hypocrites of my own faith. Kungfu, once again you manage to fail at humanity, I truly wonder if your parents found a ***eating chimp, shaved it and named it kungfu. You see unlike your ideology, mine says that you are redeemed through Jesus Christ and not a complete waste of life. I understand that the need you feel to insult and berate people of faith comes from the emptiness in you were your belief in no god resides. You and other atheist possess such contempt because we readily accept, enjoy and let enrich our lives the God and Christ which you so zealously deny. Unlike the people born to poverty who commonly despise the wealthy for the inequality between them, all you need do is open your heart to receive His wealth. It is your choice to spurn it, but blaming others for your own decision is hardly logical.
that's where you're wrong, it's what you have faith in, it's just that you try to rely on faith in life. I don't care if you have a belief in jesus, or the fsm, both are equal. both would get the same amount of laugh when people try to tell me it's "real" and both will get critized equally when they bring it up.
If belittling my belief in Jesus is how you demonstrate the tolerance and moral superiority of your ideology then you truly are no better then the hypocrites of my own faith. Kungfu, once again you manage to fail at humanity, I truly wonder if your parents found a ***eating chimp, shaved it and named it kungfu. You see unlike your ideology, mine says that you are redeemed through Jesus Christ and not a complete waste of life. I understand that the need you feel to insult and berate people of faith comes from the emptiness in you were your belief in no god resides. You and other atheist possess such contempt because we readily accept, enjoy and let enrich our lives the God and Christ which you so zealously deny. Unlike the people born to poverty who commonly despise the wealthy for the inequality between them, all you need do is open your heart to receive His wealth. It is your choice to spurn it, but blaming others for your own decision is hardly logical.
how does one open a living heart?
wouldn't that be a bit silly and possibly cause death?
:P
I personally am an Atheist who has not belittled you for your beliefs, why must you generalize when you do not like being generalized yourself?
I don't hold contempt for my Christian friends for what they believe in as they do not hold contempt for my own personal ideologies.
Also, hate the sin not the sinner.
Which is something you seem to not be doing.
:D
What I do dislike is when people emphasize their relationship with god but then post things like this:
Quote:
Kungfu, once again you manage to fail at humanity, I truly wonder if your parents found a ***eating chimp, shaved it and named it kungfu.
so by example, you are one of those very hypocrites that you have problems with.
spare thy rod for once!
amusingly enough.
kungfu is a username.
an online identity if you will.
i'd imagine his parents didn't refer to him as "kung fu"
care to live by the example of your christ and leave it as it is?
i try to live like that and I'm not faithful in the least so I'd imagine it should be several times easier to one of faith to do so.
i really do hope you don't just take this as something negative directed towards you and decide that my opinion doesn't matter.
:/
but i guess that's all on you :D
keep cool and enjoy your christmas.
