The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos

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The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos
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By 2018-06-22 08:35:20
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 Fenrir.Skarwind
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2018-06-22 10:05:10
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DirectX said: »
Is there any time that Rekiko is better than gsword or great axe or is it just a fun toy?

It's pretty useful when you need to throw on a Shield, but you want to keep dealing damage/stay alive. Savage Blade is still pretty nasty. The regain is also pretty sweet.

Between the weapon's stats, Blurred Shield +1, Relic+3 Head, AF+3 Body, Knob, Sulevia +2 Feet, Ambu Cape, and Ody Hands; You will have some really mean weaponskill damage, along with various tp bonuses from moonshade and fencer. Savage Blade is pretty beastly, and even Vorpal Blade isn't bad to fire off with Sekka up.

Honestly just use it when you feel like it. (as long as it isn't a High Level NM Zerg, If you are doing lower tiers for clears just use whatever weapons you want)

For maximum damage GS/GAXE will always be better. But using a sword will give you more survivability between the Shield Blocks and Sanguine Blade during Oh-***moments (if the mob isn't resistant).

Doing s little less damage and surviving is better than going all out and dying. (Anni vs Form for example.)

Say you are fighting Shedu or something and you end up taking hate during hundred fists. With a 2H weapon you will probably hit the floor fairly quick. With a shield on it improves your odds, and I've actually tanked it through it's HF Spam.

Everything is pretty much situational though.

I always keep the following weapons/shields on me:

The best part of this job is being able to switch things up during non critical fights.
 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-22 11:15:54
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I only wish fencer gave 10% JA haste instead of 10% crit. WS speed is terribly hampered with single wield setups unless a DNC is present.
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2018-06-22 11:53:57
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Asura.Saevel said: »
I only wish fencer gave 10% JA haste instead of 10% crit. WS speed is terribly hampered with single wield setups unless a DNC is present.

Agreed, part of me wishs Hasso/Seigen worked with fencer. But that might just be ridiculous.
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By Odin.Willster 2018-06-22 12:28:18
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DirectX said: »
Is there any time that Rekiko is better than gsword or great axe or is it just a fun toy?
I use it for the Pain Sync NM in Omen. If I double or triple with sword it's fine, but when that happens with a 2H it can get messy.
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2018-06-22 12:44:11
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Odin.Willster said: »
DirectX said: »
Is there any time that Rekiko is better than gsword or great axe or is it just a fun toy?
I use it for the Pain Sync NM in Omen. If I double or triple with sword it's fine, but when that happens with a 2H it can get messy.

On some of the Dread Spike NMs, I tried using a sword..

Super buffed you can still 1 shot yourself with a double attack lol.. Makes me kinda sad.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-22 13:30:23
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Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
Odin.Willster said: »
DirectX said: »
Is there any time that Rekiko is better than gsword or great axe or is it just a fun toy?
I use it for the Pain Sync NM in Omen. If I double or triple with sword it's fine, but when that happens with a 2H it can get messy.

On some of the Dread Spike NMs, I tried using a sword..

Super buffed you can still 1 shot yourself with a double attack lol.. Makes me kinda sad.

The benefit is that you can disengage and still gain TP from the regain on the sword. With gearswap you can also WS without engaging so makes dealing with dread spikes much easier.
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By zaxtiss 2018-06-22 13:50:49
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
Odin.Willster said: »
DirectX said: »
Is there any time that Rekiko is better than gsword or great axe or is it just a fun toy?
I use it for the Pain Sync NM in Omen. If I double or triple with sword it's fine, but when that happens with a 2H it can get messy.

On some of the Dread Spike NMs, I tried using a sword..

Super buffed you can still 1 shot yourself with a double attack lol.. Makes me kinda sad.

The benefit is that you can disengage and still gain TP from the regain on the sword. With gearswap you can also WS without engaging so makes dealing with dread spikes much easier.
i thought that was only with ranged type WS?
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-06-22 13:52:49
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zaxtiss said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
With gearswap you can also WS without engaging so makes dealing with dread spikes much easier.
i thought that was only with ranged type WS?

Gearswap lets you do it with any ws
 
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 Asura.Byrne
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By Asura.Byrne 2018-06-22 16:11:44
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If you're using gearswap and shortcuts you can just /savageblade while targeting the NM.

I think without shortcuts you just use a macro.

/ws "Savage Blade" <t>

Also another tip for NM's that use Dread Spikes is to TP on their adds (if there are any) and WS on the boss.
 
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By 2018-06-23 14:13:44
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By Afania 2018-06-23 14:18:19
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DirectX said: »
while disengaged? wtf

Gs could do that for very long time. That's how people pop soldiers drink before pop and win parse.
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2018-06-23 14:24:20
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Asura.Byrne said: »
If you're using gearswap and shortcuts you can just /savageblade while targeting the NM.

I think without shortcuts you just use a macro.

/ws "Savage Blade" <t>

Also another tip for NM's that use Dread Spikes is to TP on their adds (if there are any) and WS on the boss.
Usually I try to do this, but sometimes only one attack round is all it takes. Occassionally I am too late on turning/disengaging. Plop lol
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-23 14:41:59
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Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
Asura.Byrne said: »
If you're using gearswap and shortcuts you can just /savageblade while targeting the NM.

I think without shortcuts you just use a macro.

/ws "Savage Blade" <t>

Also another tip for NM's that use Dread Spikes is to TP on their adds (if there are any) and WS on the boss.
Usually I try to do this, but sometimes only one attack round is all it takes. Occassionally I am too late on turning/disengaging. Plop lol

There should be zero attack rounds in the situation we gave, zero. If your using gearswap then you can WS without having to engage, provided your not using a really shitty that one deliberately blocks that.
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By xaniko 2018-06-23 15:54:34
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Should I work on Conqueror or Chango? Already have a raetic algol+1
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-23 16:06:26
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xaniko said: »
Should I work on Conqueror or Chango? Already have a raetic algol+1

Conq is a shiny trophy item as it just does the same thing Montante +1 / Raetic do only to an inferior level. Chango on the other hand specializes in doing SC's which is something the Great Swords can't do well.
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By xaniko 2018-06-23 16:11:51
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Asura.Saevel said: »
xaniko said: »
Should I work on Conqueror or Chango? Already have a raetic algol+1

Conq is a shiny trophy item as it just does the same thing Montante +1 / Raetic do only to an inferior level. Chango on the other hand specializes in doing CS's which is something the Great Swords can't do well.

Thanks!
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By Asura.Xelnok 2018-06-23 19:55:51
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How does Ukon compare to Chango? I think I remember reading that they were close.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-23 21:17:33
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Asura.Xelnok said: »
How does Ukon compare to Chango? I think I remember reading that they were close.

Not remotely...

Ukon lags behind the rest because it's tied to a bad WS and it's STR bonus does nothing for GAXE's best WS Upheaval. Chango on the other hand gives a sizable TP Bonus along with +10 Store TP which works extremely well with GAXE's best WS. Then there is the entire point of Chango, making SC's and in that regard is destroys everything else. If your going to spam just one WS then use a Great Sword, Resolution is absolutely brutal in a WAR's hands and there are several amazing Great Swords for it.
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By Davorin 2018-06-23 23:08:35
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TP Bonus is a thing, sure, and it's all in the description of the weapon, so I don't understand why you'd need to say so; but does Chango really
Quote:
destroys everything else.
even if your main focus is skillchains? How much is
Quote:
destroys everything else.
? You're not really answering Xelnok's question. You're being hyperbolic.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-23 23:19:59
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Davorin said: »
TP Bonus is a thing, sure, and it's all in the description of the weapon, so I don't understand why you'd need to say so; but does Chango really
Quote:
destroys everything else.
even if your main focus is skillchains? How much is
Quote:
destroys everything else.
? You're not really answering Xelnok's question. You're being hyperbolic.

Nope that's just you being daft on purpose.

Asura.Saevel said: »
Then there is the entire point of Chango, making SC's and in that regard is destroys everything else.

Asura.Saevel said: »
If your going to spam just one WS then use a Great Sword, Resolution is absolutely brutal in a WAR's hands and there are several amazing Great Swords for it.

If it's a WS spam contest then Chango beats Ukon yet GS beats them both.
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By Afania 2018-06-23 23:45:57
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Asura.Xelnok said: »
How does Ukon compare to Chango? I think I remember reading that they were close.


It completely depends on whether NM has Amnesia move and how close the fight to 3 min(Ukon performs best in a 3 min fight because that's the am duration), and if you can prebuff with am3.

I wouldn't say gs is the best choice in ws spamming situation if your setup is tank cor war brd geo healer. From my experience upheaval (both Chango or ukon works) kills much faster than gs just because upheaval sc light with savage blade. The only situation that I would consider gs is alliance content with even more DDs.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-24 11:46:02
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Afania said: »
I wouldn't say gs is the best choice in ws spamming situation if your setup is tank cor war brd geo healer


That is not a WS spam situation, you even admit that.

That is a typical 6 man PT with 1.5 DD's. If the players have half a brain then they won't be spamming WS's and instead do two SC's.

First for opener
Sekka Full Break -> Upheaval -> Savage Blade -> Upheaval

Then execute until the fight is finished
Upheaval -> Savage Blade -> Upheaval

WAR's generate around 50~100% the TP speed of DD COR's, this setup enables the COR to charge up TP to close a powerful light with Savage Blade while also giving the WAR time to charge up Upheaval for an even more powerful Radiance.

If it's "not worth cordinating SC's" then it's not worth using an inferior WS selection on the random chance at producing those same inferior SC's.
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By Afania 2018-06-24 13:27:44
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Afania said: »
I wouldn't say gs is the best choice in ws spamming situation if your setup is tank cor war brd geo healer


That is not a WS spam situation, you even admit that.

That is a typical 6 man PT with 1.5 DD's. If the players have half a brain then they won't be spamming WS's and instead do two SC's.

First for opener
Sekka Full Break -> Upheaval -> Savage Blade -> Upheaval

Then execute until the fight is finished
Upheaval -> Savage Blade -> Upheaval

WAR's generate around 50~100% the TP speed of DD COR's, this setup enables the COR to charge up TP to close a powerful light with Savage Blade while also giving the WAR time to charge up Upheaval for an even more powerful Radiance.

If it's "not worth cordinating SC's" then it's not worth using an inferior WS selection on the random chance at producing those same inferior SC's.

I wasn't talking about 2 person multi stepping either, in the above setup we actually had RUN DDing too, so multiple stepping usually isn't faster than 3 person all spam strongest ws at 1000 tp, since multi step in above setup=one person will over tp and lowers dps. Multi step works best with 2 person, with 3+ is normally not as effective.

Savage is fragmentation, resolution with Lionheart or dimidiation is light fragmentation, Chango upheaval is fusion light. So even if all 3 person spam ws at exactly 1000, random light still happens very frequently. And it's possible to ws to close a double light from war or run too.

If war use resolution in the above scenerio, all 3 ws would be fragmentation and 0 sc would happen between spams.

We used that setup for meeble VD(Dec 2017) and managed to clear in 3.5 min. War changed to gs and it was slower.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-24 13:49:48
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Afania said: »
Savage is fragmentation, resolution with Lionheart or dimidiation is light fragmentation, Chango upheaval is fusion light. So even if all 3 person spam ws at exactly 1000, random light still happens very frequently. And it's possible to ws to close a double light from war or run too.

You will have very very few SC's because there is a minimum ~3s period between when a WS goes off and when it's possible to link off it. If your WS spamming then just use your strongest and stop going half *** and trying to be special.

Afania said: »
War changed to gs and it was slower.

That's cause you most likely suck, badly.

We get it, you want to do "something different" and "buck the tend", stuff it cause the results have been in for awhile now. Resolution >> Upheaval >>> everything else. GAXE Chango only pulls ahead when you can consistently make SC's. Three people spamming WS's won't do that. Two people can coordinate and make that happen to spectacular effect.
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By Sylph.Cherche 2018-06-24 14:28:32
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Afania said: »
Savage is fragmentation, resolution with Lionheart or dimidiation is light fragmentation, Chango upheaval is fusion light. So even if all 3 person spam ws at exactly 1000, random light still happens very frequently. And it's possible to ws to close a double light from war or run too.

You will have very very few SC's because there is a minimum ~3s period between when a WS goes off and when it's possible to link off it. If your WS spamming then just use your strongest and stop going half *** and trying to be special.
You know very well this is ***. I distinctly remember you and Bloodlusty trying this same argument in regards to Torcleaver vs Resolution. There was even a video posted to discredit SCs happening in full alliance zergs. Which failed spectacularly as SCs were happening constantly throughout the fight.
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By Afania 2018-06-24 15:21:59
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Asura.Saevel said: »
That's cause you most likely suck, badly.

YouTube Video Placeholder


5:21 D clear speed with your awesome resolution spam v.s:

Afania said: »
We used that setup for meeble VD(Dec 2017) and managed to clear in 3.5 min. War changed to gs and it was slower.

(Same fight) K.

Look, I don't want to sound like a cocky *** but if anytime we are discussing optimal setup and all the argument you ever use is "if you don't do it my way then you suck horribly", at least kill faster yourself THEN prove you are right.

Show me a video of resolution spam in that same fight with sub 3.5 min clear in VD then I'll shut up. But when I see someone that took 5+ min to kill D trying to argue that "my way is the best way if you don't do it my way you suck" then I'm not convinced in any way, since I am already killing faster in higher difficulty setting with different approach.

Anyhow, I'm done with this argument, as it's completely pointless atm.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-06-24 15:22:25
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There is a ~3s period from when a WS goes off to when another WS can link with it. With two people doing WS's they will link every couple of WS, with 3 people doing WS's linking only happens every six to nine WSs depending on average cycle time. Effectively everyone is stepping on each others toes and not allowing the window to open, so your only left when everyone's TP lines up such that there is a 3s delay between when one person WS's and another has 1000TP. It has to do with a target only being able to have 1 SC attribute present on them and a minimum amount of time needing to take place before a second attribute will link with the first to create a SC in the first place. If you have three T3 Light property WS's going off precisely 2s apart from each other you will never get a single light SC. If instead all three WS'd at the same time, then waited 3s and WS'd again you would get a single light SC. The effectiveness of SC's diminish's dramatically after DD count exudes two.

A broken clock being right twice a day doesn't make it not-broken.

Now go scamper back under your bridge.

*edit*
This was for the guy I was dumb enough to unmute. I have realized you can't fix stupid and have reapplied the remedy.
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