INT+ Over Magic Atk Bonus?

In fact, pretty much overall imo but that is for another discussion.

There is very little benefit to apoc in the duo setup you are talking about either. Or overall (outside of triple attack of course)

Just take it off and compare to when it's on. Track how long it takes to kill mob. Or do whatever weird parse you want to do. I bet the difference will be so slight you wont notice

Compared to what? Allure, where the -enmity isn't doing ***for me in that situation, where the +mp isn't doing ***and where a measly 30mnd will make such a HUGE difference? I think I will stick with the auto-reraise saftey net and my nice insta cast procs. You are severely undervaluing apoc atma.

I meant compared to nothing. Yes I meant it will do next to nothing for your kill speed if anything at all. It could be doing something for you if your blm wasn't such a pussy and casted more.

You are seriously over estimating it. And underestimating slow/para. It isn't just more potency but can make the difference in actually landing it or not

I bet you you will kill nms faster with allure than apoc on your blm.

Herp derp, allure does nothing for damage. In a duo situation your concern shouldn't be with dmg until grellow is done. Afterwards you can nuke freely. I said this in an earlier post, you nuke freely until you get hate and use manawall/enmity douse and then nuke freely again and accomplice. NMs won't last long enough for anything else to matter. In that situation you will most likely get a apoc proc on a nuke and double your dmg for most part, allure will be doing NOTHING during that time except a few extra mp for another nuke (provided you run out... which not really possible with temp items/martello use).

Herp a derp insta cast does nothing for dmg either!!!

Think outside the box. The less your tank spends casting utsesmi the more time he is DDing. The less time you have to cure him the more time you have to nuke also less emnity you have and more mp. And in a duo situation with so few procs you should always care about dmg you aren't killing ***that fast. And sure crap nms wont last long enough to worry about emnity if your jas are up... but +2 mobs often will so yeah emnity matters. What happens if you don't get a proc on that nuke which is very easily likely. Yep it's doing nothing. Apoc proc doesn't even come close to doubling your dmg. You save all of a bout 3-4 seconds casting blizz 5 on insta cast. Are you seriously non stop nuking once you proc outside of jaing? Do you have no other nukes? Cause I call bs if you do. And who the hell fights near martellos with any consistancy?

Yes you non stop nuke once you proc grellow, provided there isn't damage resistances or absorptions. Why not? The only time you stop and take concern for enmity is when you run out of tools to lose it, accomplice etc.


Have you ever tanked on THF? lol


What? You must play with some shitty *** thf's then. My THF is all the dmg I really need, BLM is there to speed it up after grellow proc.


Good lord, do you realize you can cast it again 1 second after you just used it? Compared to the 30~ish seconds normally? How is that not double dmg?

Um cause you will die... idk maybe you blms dmg just sucks I guess.


I believe I already said that but regardless it's just common sense.


Sounds more like you have a shitting blm that takes forever to find procs. Even crap nms have decent amounts of hp you aren't killing them in a minute. Yes a thf can do all the dmg... that's not the point. Faster kills are

... really? You just cast a nuke and sit there and don't do anything for 30 seconds then nuke again. Yep your blm is the shittiest abyssea burned one I've ever heard of. And you are an idiot for telling him not to do something else in the mean time. And even then that wouldn't double your dmg unless somehow the tank does all the dmg in time for you to have only done 1 nuke.... oh wait you are casting proc spells. Nope guess that isn't happening then

HMMMM

If 1 insta cast doubles your dmg does chainspell give you infinite dmg?

Only if you have atma of allure on for the hidden MAB+9001

Shush it's a secret (only active during brew).... wouldn't that just be a kick in the pants though. If some atmas had different effects under brew. Especially ones that mostly do things that the brew caps anyways so you wouldn't even think about it

Gonna have to agree with Dasva here, if I'm healing on BLM dualbox or something, MM Allure Beyond all the way.

The only time I use Apoc on BLM is if I duo CC as BLMx2 for some easy nukes :P

I don't understand, I really don't.

It's ok I don't think anyone understands you using apoc

Someone said they use it as well a few pages back, nice try!

He said sometimes... and it was mostly out of laziness because of RR lol

But yeah, with 1 DD on it, the mob gets very little tp.
So, it's easy to land proc spells, and you rarely need to stun.
Having more MP to nuke more, is a bigger benefit, atleast for me in these situations.
Often find myself nuking away all my mp, just using the little I can refresh back for stun and cures >_>

AoA doesn't increase overall DMG at all, or at best, very marginally vs. no atma at all. Regardless of whether you instantly cast a spell or not, you're bound by the same timers (since realistically you can empty your pool and not see a single proc), same MP pool, same MP cost, at best it helps you empty your pool in a shorter amount of time, it'll gain you maybe 30 seconds to get a head start /healing over the other guy using another atma since it's proc rate is so low. It's nice when it procs on Stun, or Utsusemi, or Stoneskin, or anything really, but it's so small a gain.

Oh, and suck less if you need Apoc's auto RR for success.

i used to use mm/ambition/allure for grellow. now i use mm/ambition/apoc. yes, i do ***damage, but i heal fine either way.

personally i find apoc nice for recast on cure iv too.

Oh, and if you need the stun timer so often, I'm pretty sure its a bigger benefit to use the atma from rani, or omnipotent for overall better stun timer :P

I use MM, Beyond, and Ultimate in Xp parties. If procing, I swap ultimate with foe flayer

WOW you 2 sure love to argue >< time to get a life or something close to it? But with the 5/5 +2 Goetia set I can see where Allure would come in more handy thanks to the dmg bonus the set will give. Now Dasva and Draylo this section was originally to compare INT over MAB getting a weebit off topic dont ya think?

i really need to get some Atmas. Ive been using MM, and Atma of Gale >.<

Personally I use MM Beyond Ultimate most of the time, rarely really need 15tic refresh..

This ever good to use? I've never got too caught up in the math of nuking, at least the really in depth for whats slightly better than what and when. I've only seen a handful of these on other people. Majority are the augmented diamond rings or icesoul rings, so i figured I'd throw it out there and find out.

Though it was .5 MaB for any INT that goes over the monster natural INT.Remember back at 75, some1 told me to get (for stuff like ouryu/fafnir ect not puddings..) something like 120 int total (gears + natural int) then pure MaB > Int > Magic acc > Elemental skill.

Does that calculation still stands?And anyone know what is the new base int we should have?Always wondered but never bothered with all the new gear/MM atma.

([Your int - mob int] *(spell multiplier here) +(spell base here)) *(staff bonus+atma ele. attackbonus here) *(day/weather bonus here) *(MAB bonus here) *(additional damage here(ie mob taking extra damage etc)

This is all you need to know^

The whole 120/320 int, 1int to 2mab and all that is just numbers being thrown around in a specific situation for a specific gear set for a specific tier set nuke.

The only actual trial and error that youll get stuck with is just basically guesstimating your mobs int. It can be difficult at times since mobs have mdb/-dt% or a specific resist rate.


** note: HQ staff step is a seperate step from atma ele. attack unlike magi+3 staff which is additive with atma ele.attack %)