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Regulate Religion, Not Guns.
Serveur: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-12-03 12:12:31
Ramuh.Dasva
Serveur: Ramuh
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Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2009-12-03 12:12:43
Bahamut.Stanflame said: Remora.Narrubia said: Ragnarok.Anye said: Seraph.Bulleta said: 5. Fossil records clearly show that there was life on Earth before humans. There's also a few errors in carbon dating, if you're not aware. Referring to this article in wikipedia, Radiocarbon dating - The need for calibration, Wikipedia said: A raw BP date cannot be used directly as a calendar date, because the level of atmospheric 14C has not been strictly constant during the span of time that can be radiocarbon dated. The level is affected by variations in the cosmic ray intensity which is in turn affected by variations in the earth's magnetosphere. In addition, there are substantial reservoirs of carbon in organic matter, the ocean, ocean sediments (see methane hydrate), and sedimentary rocks. Changes in the Earth's climate can affect the carbon flows between these reservoirs and the atmosphere, leading to changes in the atmosphere's 14C fraction. In short, the Earth's state, surrounding atmosphere, and climate have not been constant. Scientists have to make up for it using various methods. It is entirely possible that there are many instances of dramatic geological, atmospheric, and climatic changes that they are completely unaware of. However, this could be wrong as there is no way to concretely prove either argument right or wrong. Unless you were there. I'm not sure if this kind of information is really sufficient evidence to bring up any kind of reasonable uncertainty that there wasn't life before humans:  If I'm reading this graph correctly, then there is about a 1000 year error ratio in carbon analysis for every 7000 years old the carbon actually is. Even if the calibrated trend is exponential, the difference in carbon-dated time between the first evidence of life ( 2.5 to 4.0 billion years ago) and the first evidence of human life ( 200,000 years ago) is significant enough to say with certainty that there was life before humans. does not mean that god could not have created human, or used planets as his play ground and an farm. No it means that the stories on how things happened are full of ***. And you start revealing more and more falacies in a script how can you believe any of it?
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By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:13:24
Fairy.Tbest said: Dead Sea scrolls? >.>
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-03 12:14:06
Remora.Narrubia said: Pandemonium.Aravol said: I also agree God tells us everyday, we just dont listen. We feel the only proof of existance is a visual and powerful display of strength for a God to exist. Well, God should know what would be sufficient evidence for people to believe in Him, since he created humans. And since He isn't providing this kind of evidence, we're left to wonder if He doesn't love all of us unconditionally, or if He simply doesn't exist. Is that the logic behind your point, Vegetto? No, that wasn't really my point per se. I was saying that if you're just going to go straight off the bible, then that would be my point, but like I said, I don't believe the bible.
Asura.Korpg
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By Asura.Korpg 2009-12-03 12:14:39
Fairy.Vegetto said: "But if your brother couldnt appear to u and left you letters or had " If he left me a letter, I know his handwriting. I'd know it was from him. It's still something he's doing DIRECTLY, and not something that he does indirectly. So let's say he can't appear to me, but instead of writing a letter, he turns to the person next to him "Hey write this down for me and send it to my brother" See my point? Handwriting can be faked.
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By Remora.Narrubia 2009-12-03 12:14:57
Bahamut.Stanflame said: does not mean that god could not have created human, or used planets as his play ground and an farm. Of course not, my argument in no way invalidates the possibility of God's existence/creations. I was just pointing out the misinterpretation of scientific evidence.
Ramuh.Dasva
Serveur: Ramuh
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Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2009-12-03 12:15:55
Pandemonium.Aravol said: But if your brother couldnt appear to u and left you letters or had True, Too bad god didn't there would be so much more proof then
Pandemonium.Aravol said: but we cannot possibly understand what a "perfect" being God's Mind decides to do. We are merely thoughtless compared to that. We are to selfish to think otherwise that we demand things as does a toddler when they throw a fit. Cmon really? God must be real and we can't know because he is so much greater than us doesn't even come close to proving anything.
Right now I claim I'm god. Why am I posting on a forum?... No matter what your argument is against it fails cause you can't understand my perfect mind!!!
Pandemonium.Aravol
Serveur: Pandemonium
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Posts: 475
By Pandemonium.Aravol 2009-12-03 12:16:40
Fairy.Vegetto said: Remora.Narrubia said: Pandemonium.Aravol said: I also agree God tells us everyday, we just dont listen. We feel the only proof of existance is a visual and powerful display of strength for a God to exist. Well, God should know what would be sufficient evidence for people to believe in Him, since he created humans. And since He isn't providing this kind of evidence, we're left to wonder if He doesn't love all of us unconditionally, or if He simply doesn't exist. Is that the logic behind your point, Vegetto? No, that wasn't really my point per se. I was saying that if you're just going to go straight off the bible, then that would be my point, but like I said, I don't believe the bible. Biblical History goes much deeper than the bible. If you ever notice the many holes in it that leave us asking these very questions.
I believe much was taken out of the bible due to ancient catholics doing so to better control society.
But this discussion could go on forever
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By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:16:44
Whats the meaning of life? everything people want to ask about that term aly just explained it. God probably wanted you to think for your selves if he exists or not. You have your freedom you are alive, well and enjoying what you were given be it creator, big bang etc. Whats to say god was not created with the big bang anyway?
Pandemonium.Aravol
Serveur: Pandemonium
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Posts: 475
By Pandemonium.Aravol 2009-12-03 12:18:03
Bahamut.Stanflame said: Whats the meaning of life? everything people want to ask about that term aly just explained it. God probably wanted you to think for your selves if he exists or not. You have your freedom you are alive, well and enjoying what you were given be it creator, big bang etc. Whats to say god was not created with the big bang anyway? i agree so we can exist for who we truly are. Not put on a front for "God" to get goodies.
That is twofaced, God is not.
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By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:19:07
Point is you are living, god was said to show himself to other's. Be happy, love each other etc. Be happy :).
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-03 12:19:12
Pandemonium.Aravol said: Fairy.Vegetto said: Remora.Narrubia said: Pandemonium.Aravol said: I also agree God tells us everyday, we just dont listen. We feel the only proof of existance is a visual and powerful display of strength for a God to exist. Well, God should know what would be sufficient evidence for people to believe in Him, since he created humans. And since He isn't providing this kind of evidence, we're left to wonder if He doesn't love all of us unconditionally, or if He simply doesn't exist. Is that the logic behind your point, Vegetto? No, that wasn't really my point per se. I was saying that if you're just going to go straight off the bible, then that would be my point, but like I said, I don't believe the bible. Biblical History goes much deeper than the bible. If you ever notice the many holes in it that leave us asking these very questions.
I believe much was taken out of the bible due to ancient catholics doing so to better control society.
But this discussion could go on forever Exactly, it's been edited to what whoever edited it wanted to be in there.
Bahamut.Jetackuu
Serveur: Bahamut
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Posts: 9001
By Bahamut.Jetackuu 2009-12-03 12:20:15
we agree on two points, if this so called god does exist who needs his *** *** anyway? and you're "attractive" :D
Ramuh.Dasva
Serveur: Ramuh
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Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2009-12-03 12:21:40
Pandemonium.Aravol said: Fairy.Vegetto said: Remora.Narrubia said: Pandemonium.Aravol said: I also agree God tells us everyday, we just dont listen. We feel the only proof of existance is a visual and powerful display of strength for a God to exist. Well, God should know what would be sufficient evidence for people to believe in Him, since he created humans. And since He isn't providing this kind of evidence, we're left to wonder if He doesn't love all of us unconditionally, or if He simply doesn't exist. Is that the logic behind your point, Vegetto? No, that wasn't really my point per se. I was saying that if you're just going to go straight off the bible, then that would be my point, but like I said, I don't believe the bible. Biblical History goes much deeper than the bible. If you ever notice the many holes in it that leave us asking these very questions. I believe much was taken out of the bible due to ancient catholics doing so to better control society. But this discussion could go on forever Of course that happened. Technically still is
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-03 12:27:26
In the end it all goes to the
"You can't prove he doesn't exist" argument and that's all fine and dandy to me, as my claim, which is correct, is that it is all just a theory.
Pandemonium.Aravol
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Posts: 475
By Pandemonium.Aravol 2009-12-03 12:29:14
Fairy.Vegetto said: In the end it all goes to the "You can't prove he doesn't exist" argument and that's all fine and dandy to me, as my claim, which is correct, is that it is all just a theory. Basically it is just an unproven opinion, but we all have the right to an unproven opinion i guess.
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-12-03 12:29:16
you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers.
Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot.
Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time.
Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God."
edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range.
Ramuh.Dasva
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Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2009-12-03 12:31:37
Pandemonium.Aravol said: Fairy.Vegetto said: In the end it all goes to the "You can't prove he doesn't exist" argument and that's all fine and dandy to me, as my claim, which is correct, is that it is all just a theory. Basically it is just an unproven opinion, but we all have the right to an unproven opinion i guess. Sorta but it completely contradicts convientional logic. Why do you beleive 1 unproven thing but not others? Can't really use the you can't prove otherwise argument unless you actually believe everything until proven otherwise.
Pandemonium.Aravol
Serveur: Pandemonium
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Posts: 475
By Pandemonium.Aravol 2009-12-03 12:32:46
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers. Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot. Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time. Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God." edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range. This is the type of comment we are actually avoiding here. We are having a nice intelligent conversation then someone pops this stuff in here.
I think it is interesting hearing different opinions but feel free to dog any religion if it makes you feel better.
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Posts: 3615
By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-03 12:33:13
Oh, I agree, it is a huge contradiction with logic.
Serveur: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6173
By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:33:55
Pandemonium.Aravol said: Bahamut.Stanflame said: Whats the meaning of life? everything people want to ask about that term aly just explained it. God probably wanted you to think for your selves if he exists or not. You have your freedom you are alive, well and enjoying what you were given be it creator, big bang etc. Whats to say god was not created with the big bang anyway? i agree so we can exist for who we truly are. Not put on a front for "God" to get goodies.
That is twofaced, God is not.
You are happy with your life? God should not interfere with people per say. God is not two faced never said he was. He supposedly gave people life, people fend for themselves and we do stuff on our own now. You still believe in god and do what he wants and think of heaven, hell and such and follow what he has left and what has been written in the bible. But at the same time atheist , or not religion is there. Aly stated she does not believe in got but, it was not in the sense most would think. She said she has all she needs here, she is living life to the fullest of her limits. You should not be worrying about anything else, when you die answers probably will come clear. People go to church and do bible school, let them be and do it. We are arguing over nothing is basically what people like aly is saying. I mean the OP is ignorant as an example, and pissed off lots of people. You choose your self what the meaning of life is to you, but ethics and morals come into play. Everyone knows the bible, I do not think no one thinks there is not a higher being or creator. It is probably in the reference of it as god and Christianity and other religions. If god was a powerful alien and he is sitting here, shocked people revere him as such... what if the guy goes by a different name or not? besides the numerous names he has in other religions?
I honestly , hope no one goes to hell for not thinking or believing in something =/. it is all here it is what we know whether there is a creator or not no one can't deny something is there, and there is some truths. it's all here no one can pop out of thin air and write such things, prophets, moses, jesus, etc.. it all came from some where. So everyone can't we all get along, take a chill pill.
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-12-03 12:35:09
Pandemonium.Aravol said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers. Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot. Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time. Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God." edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range. This is the type of comment we are actually avoiding here. We are having a nice intelligent conversation then someone pops this stuff in here.
I think it is interesting hearing different opinions but feel free to dog any religion if it makes you feel better.
no, just stating that its gone on far enough and people are just regurgitating everything else that everyone else already said.
There is no proof that God exists, evolution DID take place at some point, the bible is as corrupt as Supahead's tell-all book, and in the end, doesn't matter who you are, you're human and you'll die all the same.
Pandemonium.Aravol
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Posts: 475
By Pandemonium.Aravol 2009-12-03 12:36:20
Ramuh.Dasva said: Pandemonium.Aravol said: Fairy.Vegetto said: In the end it all goes to the "You can't prove he doesn't exist" argument and that's all fine and dandy to me, as my claim, which is correct, is that it is all just a theory. Basically it is just an unproven opinion, but we all have the right to an unproven opinion i guess. Sorta but it completely contradicts convientional logic. Why do you beleive 1 unproven thing but not others? Can't really use the you can't prove otherwise argument unless you actually believe everything until proven otherwise.  LOL i like the pic you posted.
I understand everyone has there own views, and i am cool with that.
WHen i tell my 5 yr old son i love him it would be hard for me to show him what love is in a "proof" standpoint, but i could just tell him i love him because i buy his clothes and food and take care of him and stuff. But would we truly understand the answer i would give him?
Anyways, im going AFK for a bit, nice talking to you guys, take care.
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By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:37:01
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers.
Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot.
Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time.
Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God."
edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range.
No need for such hostility I am trying to explain this with out being so harsh and blunt. Peace maker today.
By Gannonman 2009-12-03 12:37:07
Ramuh.Dasva said: Pandemonium.Aravol said: Fairy.Vegetto said: In the end it all goes to the "You can't prove he doesn't exist" argument and that's all fine and dandy to me, as my claim, which is correct, is that it is all just a theory. Basically it is just an unproven opinion, but we all have the right to an unproven opinion i guess. Sorta but it completely contradicts convientional logic. Why do you beleive 1 unproven thing but not others? Can't really use the you can't prove otherwise argument unless you actually believe everything until proven otherwise.

That picture is pure win my friend.
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Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-12-03 12:38:32
Bahamut.Stanflame said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers.
Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot.
Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time.
Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God."
edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range.
No need for such hostility I am trying to explain this with out being so harsh and blunt. Peace maker today.
we already know you're a dipshit anti-christ Stan, no need to fake it.
Serveur: Bahamut
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Posts: 6173
By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:38:50
Pandemonium.Aravol said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers. Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot. Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time. Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God." edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range. This is the type of comment we are actually avoiding here. We are having a nice intelligent conversation then someone pops this stuff in here.
I think it is interesting hearing different opinions but feel free to dog any religion if it makes you feel better.
was trying not to start anything, my post above this was not agreeing with KFH. Just that when i had posted the thing I did I saw his post, and was saying what he said was not needed.. because this is how flames and hostility get started.
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Posts: 24692
By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2009-12-03 12:39:44
oh yeah...
its not "Happy Holidays".. its "MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!"
Serveur: Bahamut
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Posts: 6173
By Bahamut.Stanflame 2009-12-03 12:46:10
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: Bahamut.Stanflame said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: you know what, after reading all the horseshit here about God, Mary the Virgin Dyke, and Jesus the inbred son of himself, its no *** surprise that we hate bible thumpers.
Does it really matter where we came from, how everything came about? My kids believe in Santa, so you can believe in God and not be looked at like an idiot.
Just remember that no one gives a flying rat ***cracker what YOU believe in, as long you believe in it on your own time.
Oh yeah, as Neitzche put it... "There is no God."
edit: None of you clowns can prove he exists, so stop trying and lets just go to the gun range.
No need for such hostility I am trying to explain this with out being so harsh and blunt. Peace maker today.
we already know you're a dipshit anti-christ Stan, no need to fake it.
Anti-Christ? where did you hear this from?
Serveur: Remora
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Posts: 129
By Remora.Narrubia 2009-12-03 12:47:56
Pandemonium.Aravol said: True, but we cannot possibly understand what a "perfect" being God's Mind decides to do. We are merely thoughtless compared to that. We are to selfish to think otherwise that we demand things as does a toddler when they throw a fit. But we can both agree that in Christianity, God is both omnipotent and unconditionally loves us all, right? That raises the issue of why He allows anybody to go to hell, or even live life without His presence, when He knows exactly how to make us believe. In a way, I'm citing the Epicurean Paradox, although this pertains to a somewhat different issue.
This is enough to bring many to question God's omnipotence, unconditional love, or existence. Even if he does "function" on a different level than we do, we cannot reasonably define him as "omnipotent" or "all-loving" since those are human definitions and one (or both) of which may not properly define Him.
It's an issue theological philosophers bang their heads against walls over. As such, I'm going to leave this point as is and go back to grinding my teeth over bad science.
A lot of the people in this world believe we need to regulate drugs and guns to make this a safer place. I have a different insight. I think if you're going to regulate one thing that has the most potential to cause death and destruction, it should be religion. Religion is dangerous, and I don't say this out of bitterness. I was raised catholic. I was never molested, but.. Meh i'm a little insulted lol. I was attractive, so hey it was their loss.
What I have against religion is... They start you when you are so defensless. I was 3 years old when they started pumping this BS into my head. I believed in Santa Clause and the Fairy Godmother, ofcourse I believed in virgin birth, a guy that lived in a whale, and a woman came from a rib. But then, something very important happened to me that made me doubt all of it. I graduated the 6th grade :)
What is so hard about saying "I don't know" !?
Ofcourse there are questions that plaque all of us...
How did we get here?
What happens when we die?
Is there a heaven?
Am I on the list?
Who let the dogs out?
So why would you believe some other human being (Who's brain "I promise you is no bigger or better than your own") when he tells you he knows what happens when you die?
"Don't masturbate now, or you won't get to hang out with Jesus in heaven! How do I know!? I've got a pointy hat! I have a hat, and a robe, I have smoke and a wand!"... It's so gay.
Every Sunday is like a pageant with the costumes, the wands, the goblets, the smoke, and the men kneeling down in front of other men with their mouths open.. Nothing gay about that!
Religion, easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there is an invisible man living in the sky, who watches everything you do every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of 10 things He does not want you to do. And if you do any of these 10 things, he has a special place full of fire, and smoke, and burning, and torture, and anguish, where he will send you to live to burn, and suffer, and choke, and scream, and cry forever and ever untill the end of time. BuT He LoVeS YoU <3 <3 <3 <3
He loves you and he always needs MONEY! He's all powerful, all perfect, all knowing, and all wise, but somehow he just can't handle money o.O!! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more $$$$$ Talk about a good bullshit story.. Holyshit!
This is Sincere: When it came to believing in god, I really tried. I wanted to believe that there was a god who created us in his own image, loves us very much, and keeps a close eye on things. I tried, but the longer you live, the more you look around, and the more you realize that something is ????d up:
(War Disease Death Destruction Hunger Filth Poverty Torture Crime)
This is not good work. If this is the best god can do, I am not impressed. A results like these do not belong on the resume of a supreme being. These are the results you would expect from an office temp with a bad attitude.
Between you and me... In any feasibly ran universe, this guy would have been out on his all powerful ass a long time ago. I say guy, because if there really is a god he has to be a man. No woman could or would ever ???? things up like this ^.^
If there is a god, I think that most reasonable people would agree that he is atleast incompetent, and maybe.. Just maybe.. He doesn't give a shit. Which I admire in a person, and it would explain a lot of these bad results. So instead of being just another mindless-religious robot, mindlessly.. Aimlessly.. Blindly believing that all of this is in the hands of some spooky incompitent father figure who doesn't give a shit, I decided to find something else to worship. Something I could actually count on...
I immidiatly thought of the sun. Overnight, just like that. I became a sun worshipper, but not overnight because you can't see the sun at night. But first thing the next morning....
Several reasons...
First of all, I can see the sun. (Unlike a few other gods I know). I'm big on that, if I can see something it kind of helps the credibility. So everyday I can see the sun as it gives me everything I need: Light, Heat, Food, Flowers in the Park, Reflections in the Lake, the occasional skin cancer but hey.. Atleast there are no crucifixions and setting people on fire simply because they don't agree with us.
Sun worshipping is simple. There are no mysteries, no miracles, no pageantry, noone asks for money, no songs to learn, and we don't have a building we gather together in once a week to compare clothing.
Suppose your prayers aren't answered. What do you say? Its god's will~? It will be done. Fine, but if it's god's will, he is going to do what he wants to anyway... Why the hell pray for it in the first place? Couldn't you just skip the paying, and just go straight to god's will?
I do believe prayers are answered though.. Maybe at a 50% rate! Half the time I get what I want. Half of the time I don't. Same as the four leaf clover, the horse shoe, the wishing well, the rabbit's foot, the mojo man, same as the voodoo lady that tells you fortune by squeezing a goat's testicle. It's all the same.. 50/50... So just pick your superstition, make a wish, and sit back and enjoy yourself.
And for those of you who look to the bible for moral lessons, and literary qualities... I'll suggest a few other stories for you... You might want to look at:
~The Three Little Pigs (It has a nice happy ending)
~Little Red Riding Hood (Although it has that X-rated part where the wolf actually eats the grandmother)
~Humpty Dumpty (All the king's horses, and all the king's men couldn't put humpty dumpty back together again. That's because there is no Humpty Dumpty, and there is no God.)
If there is a God, may he strike me dead!....
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o.O Nothing happened... lol
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