Chango VS Ukonvasara !!!

Yeah I was noticing Chango R-15 outdamaging R-15 Ukko by an annoying amount. This is not to say Ukko doesn't have value. In some content with amnesia, or some Ambuscade months, or like Tenzen, Ukko does win from AM.

I was also interestingly noticing the Ambuscade Axe to have better utilization in content whereas TP is difficult to gain. Such as low-buff situations.

Are you referring to dolichenus? Dolichenus will probably only win when you have low haste and can use DW to bridge the gap. But wrong thread for that.

I've seen 3 R15 Ukon WARs owners beat really decked out and very skilled R15 Chango WARs on parses in Wave3, and on zerg fights like WoC. Not a one time thing either. All the Ukon owners aforementioned also own Changos of course.

In many of these cases, they were 'competing' against each other while using different weapons. Wave3 is n't really a great indicator for a parse of course, but buffs were the same for both weapon users as well (rouge's was not used).

Chango is easier to gear for and play with effectively and 80-90% of the time (arbitrary %), with all things equal, buffs and 'skill' will edge ahead. Ukon is very very strong and competitive, depending on the wielder, and if geared for and played correctly. It takes more effort and work to do so, so it's just easier for most to main chango.

This is just what I've seen anyways. Anyone who says Ukon is 'trash' either does not how to play with it, or has not seen someone who can get the most of it. Chango, however, in most scenarios will do better.

We gotta be careful with this, chango should now be using a very different TP set most of the time. THe old 100 DA with sam/chaos is no longer (and never was) the optimal set for those buffs. It is a pretty sizeable difference. The common Ukon TP set is actually more optimized than the TP set that a lot of chango users use. Chango DPS should be a bit higher than most people think it is. It is going to take a little while for people to accept the new(ish) set and see the DPS increase. If you test ukon vs chango with ideal gear and 6 man buffs. Chango wins pretty easily. Chango is not as far ahead as some people like to think,but Ukon isn't as close as many claim either.

Wave three is a pretty horrible parse that doesnt tell you much beyond who is more consistent at switching targets and who is able to keep buffs up more consistently.
We also gotta be careful with the "i know people who out DPS people" parsing logic. Too many factors are being ignored. I have seen tauret DNC out DPS r15 sam/war/mnk/drg/drk. It happens fairly regularly. A job might win the parse because they do less damage and don't rip hate off the tank and die as often. TONNNSSSSS of factors that make wave three parses bad for general DPS. Wave three parses basically tell you who did the most DPS during that particular run.

Ukon can win on WOC sometimes, if they get lucky on stun/petrify. I have tested ideal builds for both on that mob a bunch of times. Chango wins far more often than Ukon. Ukon only wins if chango gets stunned/petrify and ukon doesnt.

Ukon isn't any harder to play, it is just a bit more annoying to buff. The actual gameplay is somewhat boring, you basically just hold TP longer.

Ukon is not trash, It is decent, chango just generally wins, maybe 1-3 fights where Ukon is the better weapon. Ukon's biggest issue isnt that it sucks, it's biggest issue is that easier to obtain options are as good/better. It is probably our second best rema weapon now. Id have to retest since new gear came out that helps Ukon since I last tested it. As it is, I would rank it as our 6th-8th best option (war has a lot of good weapons). And is harder to get than all the better options combined.

During alliance content, you can actually make Ukon outrageously strong. It takes sam/fighter/chaos/rogues + bardbuffs + SMN buffs with 2 wars in the same party alternating blood and warcry and Afterglow. I used to use that for wave three until I realized that set up makes shining one even stronger than Ukon.