point is that it wasn't hard for the Orlando guy to obtain guns legally even after being on the FBI list twice, something is wrong here.
Umm you really are misinformed....
The Orlando guy never broke any laws. He was investigate twice, first to obtain the clearance required to be a guard, and the second was because he was reported as having said things that someone who possessed a clearance shouldn't of said. The FBI investigation turned up no corroborating evidence and he was fully acquitted and investigation closed.
This is how ignorant you and your kind are. You don't know what your talking about and instead allow your emotions to be easily manipulated by others.
Now please continue telling us how already banned fully automatic weapons should be further banned. Or how any weapon that looks "scary" should be banned, or how anyone you don't like should be banned.
point is that it wasn't hard for the Orlando guy to obtain guns legally even after being on the FBI list twice, something is wrong here.
Also 7 of the 19 hijackers listed are still alive.
Satam al Suqami, Wail and Waleed al Shehri (two brothers) Both Alive, Abdul Aziz al Omari Alive, Fayez Banihammad (from the UAE), Ahmed al Ghamdi, Hamza al Ghamdi, Mohand al Shehri Alive, Saeed al Ghamdi Alive, Ahmad al Haznawi, Ahmed al Nami Alive, Majed Moqed, and Salem al Hazmi Alive (the brother of Nawaf al Hazmi).
How can the 9/11 Commission be taken seriously when they refer to alive 'hijackers'?
semi automatics that killed 50 people, if your answer is simply a moment of silence I don't know what to say. I'm not going to argue this. I simply believe measures could be taken to decrease the amount of mass-murder in the US.
I don't want to take anyone's guns away, I just want to prevent mass-murderer's from obtaining them easily.
This is why my opinion is that you can't just have laws for weapons, guns, drugs. You have to go the whole nine yards and take all the proper countermeasures. Omar Mateen's father was radicalized before ever setting foot on US soil, and because there was not a process to look into someone like him better, he raised a radicalized son.
The guy had connections to the Taliban, he tried to run for Afghan president, he stated after the shootings he didn't approve of what his son did but "god" ultimately will judge homosexuals, etc. This didn't start with Omar Mateen, it started with his family and their background. Omar Mateen would be just another member of IS, dead or alive, if his father had been identified during his immigration.
When someone like Omar is already making contact with IS, he's going to get a gun one way or another. He just had a convenient means to obtain one already. You can't stop just at those means, you have to go the full step and prevent radicals from bringing their ideas into your safe or moderate home.
The links I posted above have that info but since we are talking about this shooting and the progressive fear of "AR-15!!!!" I didn't bring up the vintage weapons, especially as they are collectors items and someone wanting to do really bad stuff has easier access to semi-automatics. Hell the weapon you listed cost $35K USD and it's used. A new AR-15 semi-automatic costs ~$800 USD.
The links I posted above have that info but since we are talking about this shooting and the progressive fear of "AR-15!!!!" I didn't bring up the vintage weapons, especially as they are collectors items and someone wanting to do really bad stuff has easier access to semi-automatics. Hell the weapon you listed cost $35K USD and it's used. A new AR-15 semi-automatic costs ~$800 USD.
that quote "we don't want to disarm you" came from who? not me. Try to make it clear who your quoting please, again; not trying to argue, trying to find solutions to mass murder of innocent people. I don't really care about people's gun collections. it adds up to nothing to 1 innocent human life.
some people can actually hold conversations on this topic in a civil manor.
that quote "we don't want to disarm you" came from who? not me. Try to make it clear who your quoting please, again; not trying to argue, trying to find solutions to mass murder of innocent people. I don't really care about people's gun collections. it adds up to nothing to 1 innocent human life.
some people can actually hold conversations on this topic in a civil manor.
trying to find solutions to mass murder of innocent people. I don't really care about people's gun collections. it adds up to nothing to 1 innocent human life.
You have already made up your mind, reducing total gun ownership = less shootings / deaths / <insert desired result here>. You are now going about the process of seeking justification, any will do, for that belief.
Actual information, data, casual relationships, contributing factors, none of that matters to you, only reducing the amount of gun ownership.
seriously this video actually has substance, unlike the last few pages of this thread. it doesn't matter what side you are on. it's 2 ppl that actually are thinking and looking for solutions from opposite sides
And now to put a screeching halt on anyone else attempting to use this nut job and the associated tragedy as a political soap box to preach the religion they've been preaching for decades.
If this guy hadn't had a fire arm he would of simply used the preferred method of his religion, the suicide vest and other associated explosives. He was already willing to die for his cause and making explosives at home is easy, anyone of you could do it. He already smuggled in a large bag of ammunition along with a large rifle, it would of been easier for him to have a suicide vest and a bunch of smaller bombs. Doing so he would of easily doubled his total body count and destroyed large portions of that building as explosives are FAR more dangerous inside confined spaces then in the outside. All those walls and ceiling act as amplification for the concussive blast, its the exact concept behind how a small amount of gunpowder gives so much force to a bullet.
So be glad this idiot decided to emulate a scene from Call of Duty instead of using his faith's more traditional methods.
So be glad this idiot decided to emulate a scene from Call of Duty instead of using his faith's more traditional methods.
nobody in there right mind should "be glad" about any of this. We should be looking for solutions, not pointing fingers and leaching onto political gain.
50 humans died. Imagine if that was your local bar you went to everyday and everyone from your local spot was dead or in the hospital. it's not a time to argue, it's a time to morn reflect and think how to prevent needless bloodshed.
50 humans died. Imagine if that was your local bar you went to everyday and everyone from your local spot was dead or in the hospital. it's not a time to argue, it's a time to morn reflect and think how to prevent needless bloodshed.
This is prime example of doing such, it's an attempt at emotional manipulation. You get people emotionally invested in your cause and then persuade them towards your own solution because it appeals to that emotional investment.
The killer was a registered Democrat who killed those people to make a political statement. He did this precisely because progressives would make a huge stink about it and attempt another grab at lawful guns owners. Those gun owners would fight back and cause even more political strife. A suicide vest would be killed even more people and been much easier to execute but wouldn't of ignited the gun debate and the resulting political tension.
point is that it wasn't hard for the Orlando guy to obtain guns legally even after being on the FBI list twice, something is wrong here.
Last I checked being on the FBI's list isn't subject to due process, or requiring to actually have committed a crime, so no there's nothing wrong there.
I shared it. Not surprisingly, no comments or reactions from my liberal or conservative friends because it's the *** internet and no one is willing to concede anything, ever.
"A sobering message to both the liberal AND conservative factions in this country:
If Omar Mateen does not represent all Muslims, then he also does not represent all gun owners.
If Omar Mateen does not represent all gun owners, then he also does not represent all Muslims."
