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First official GOP President announcement
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-03-24 21:06:20
You really are riding that hyperbole train lately.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-24 21:07:05
You really are riding that hyperbole train lately.
It works so well for the "conservative" posters, I figured I'd give it a try.
Seriously, though, it was a joke. Poking fun at Cruz's saying ACA is the end of liberty while signing up for health insurance under it.
By Enuyasha 2015-03-24 21:08:14
My argument wasn't about whether or not he affected, or had any involvement with the government shutdown.
But I will address this: The reason you fail to see me budging on certain issues, is that most of the time, the other side can not provide info, *or* a reasonable discussion, or interpretation of the information they do provide, that could persuade me to think my stance or thought on the issue could be swayed to think differently, or they ignore every counter-point made that destroys their argument.
My point is this: You get stuff on technicality.. and o.k. technicality is all it takes, so in that case you are right.
I see what he did as a passionate speech, not a filibuster(though as you have proved it is indeed a filibuster) I just do not see the objective of what he did to be what you say. He just wanted to get up and speak before it was passed, he knew nothing he did would stop it, so it was merely symbolic. Confirmation bias and ignorance of procedure :< Why are you arguing this again?
The origin of this debate was about him being responsible for the government shutdown as alot of naive people claim(some, but not alot on this site)
The only way he could be 'responsible' for it, is if his 'filibuster' caused it.. which it did not.
And ok, I take back something I said earlier.. that he had 'nothing' to do with it.. I admit that was too strong a word.. he is indeed a member of the senate, so he did indeed vote on it. Sauce.
Quote: In July and August 2013, Sen. Mike Lee, along with fellow Tea Party-affiliated Senators Ted Cruz of Texas,[47] Marco Rubio of Florida,[47][48] and Rand Paul of Kentucky,[47] lobbied their colleagues in the Senate to support a letter written by Lee calling for defunding the Affordable Care Act. The letter was eventually signed by 19 senators, although 5 of the co-signatories later withdrew their support.[49][50]
Freshman Rep. Mark Meadows of North Carolina circulated a similar letter in the House of Representatives that was signed by 80 House members.[49][51][52] The New York Daily News wrote that it was Meadows' letter that had put the federal government on the road to shutdown,[53] noting that calls to defund the Affordable Care Act through spending bills languished until Meadows wrote an open letter on August 21, 2013, to House Speaker John Boehner and Majority Leader Eric Cantor asking them to defund the Affordable Care Act in any appropriations bills brought to the House floor.[51][54] CNN described Meadows as the "architect of the brink" for his letter.[52]
Joshua Withrow of the Tea Party group FreedomWorks, which had endorsed the Meese coalition's plan months earlier,[45] explained the overall strategy, writing in August 2013 that the continuing resolution due to expire September 30 "must be renewed in order for the doors to stay open in Washington. The CR is the best chance we will get to withdraw funds from Obamacare. This can be done by attaching bills by Senator Ted Cruz (R-TX) or Congressman Tom Graves (R-GA) to the CR, which will totally defund Obamacare."[55] He added, "Senator Mike Lee (R-UT) and Congressman Mark Meadows (R-NC) are leading the charge to get their colleagues to commit to this approach, by putting their signatures to a letter affirming that they will refuse to vote for a CR that contains Obamacare funding...."[55]
Quote: Signed the letter
Jeffrey Chiesa (NJ)
Mike Crapo (ID)
Ted Cruz (TX)
Mike Enzi (WY)
Deb Fischer (NE)
Chuck Grassley (IA)
Jim Inhofe (OK)
Mike Lee (UT)
Rand Paul (KY)
Jim Risch (ID)
Pat Roberts (KS)
Marco Rubio (FL)
John Thune (SD)
David Vitter (LA)
Signed but later withdrew support
Kelly Ayotte (NH)
John Boozman (AR)
John Cornyn (TX)
Mark Kirk (IL)
Roger Wicker (MS)
His "Passionate speech" (Filibuster) Delayed the vote further (Or rather, debate which wouldve lead to a vote). Which had an "Effect" for a "Cause" of the government shutdown.
You know, outside of him actually signing and then remaining supportive of the attempt anyway.
Side note: I feel like The Merovingian (-______-)
By Zackan 2015-03-24 21:12:27
You really are riding that hyperbole train lately.
It works so well for the "conservative" posters, I figured I'd give it a try.
Seriously, though, it was a joke. Poking fun at Cruz's saying ACA is the end of liberty while signing up for health insurance under it. obviously missing the point
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-03-24 21:13:02
You really are riding that hyperbole train lately.
It works so well for the "conservative" posters, I figured I'd give it a try.
Seriously, though, it was a joke. Poking fun at Cruz's saying ACA is the end of liberty while signing up for health insurance under it.
Is there anybody out there that can run for president (and actually stand a chance) without the skeletons in the closet, or is that mandatory nowadays?
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-24 21:20:10
I thought it was a requirement.
Makes the candidate seem more human, sometimes in an inhumane way.
Because who would believe a candidate was clean?
By Jetackuu 2015-03-24 21:21:38
It's hard. I'm a republican since forever but I cannot get behind these tea party people. They always struck me as racist fearmongers. I guess we will have to see who else joins the race. I do not like ultra-conservative candidates.
You know who is a racist fearmonger? Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton.
I can buy the fearmonger to a very small extent.. I listen to Glenn Beck and there are those who accuse him of being a fearmonger(I don't buy that)
Tea Party is a Party of Constitutional Conservatives with a taste of Libertarian. All we want is a strict following of the constitution.. We also want the Government to back the F off. We push stuff like new amendments to the constitution (2 specifically, the Balanced budget amendment= budget MUST be balanced every year, and Term limits on Congress= typically the limit should be 12 years.)
We want Tax Reform. Abolishment of certain government agencies. so on and so forth.
The reason the Tea Party is so against Obama is at least 2 reasons: 1: Well truth be told he is democrat(liberal/progressive)
2: He LOVES his executive agreements.
1. One of those two proposed amendments is mentally HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, and devoid of an understanding of economics or reality.
2. define "strict" and "follow"
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-24 21:22:06
You really are riding that hyperbole train lately.
It works so well for the "conservative" posters, I figured I'd give it a try.
Seriously, though, it was a joke. Poking fun at Cruz's saying ACA is the end of liberty while signing up for health insurance under it.
Is there anybody out there that can run for president (and actually stand a chance) without the skeletons in the closet, or is that mandatory nowadays?
Nobody is perfect, obviously, but the level of blatant hypocrisy across the board has become ridiculous in the last 15 or so years. The level of partisan BS and brinksmanship is out of control, and the 24hr news cycle has literally destroyed political journalism.
If we can get a candidate who is eligible, has an actual plan besides "repeal this law", has an actual budget proposal that isn't just a pile of projections, has some non-partisan ideas, isn't overtly bankrolled by billionaires and their shadow-corporations, etc. It's just a matter of who smiles best and how pissed the undecided voters are, no candidate in 30 years has actually been qualified in any real respect, and only about 3 of the last 15 presidents had any real integrity or expertise (and not the ones you think I mean).
The fact is, the only way things are going to get better for the working class is when they all wise up and rise above the pathetic partisan bickering contest the powers that be have given them to distract them from what's really going on: a systematic transfer of power and wealth from the masses.
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By Sayomi 2015-03-24 21:22:19
Need a real POTUS at the moment because the current one is hellbent on pushing big government down our throats. I'd rather have a POTUS that loves America. Nuke Deal {No, Thanks.} -> http://www.ijreview.com/2015/03/265234-ad-refusal/?fb_action_ids=1549971898617573&fb_action_types=og.shares
By Enuyasha 2015-03-24 21:22:53
I thought it was a requirement.
Makes the candidate seem more human, sometimes in an inhumane way.
Because who would believe a candidate was clean? The problem with having a "Clean" candidate would mean theyd have to have no elected office experience. *** love when their candidate gots some elected office experience.
By Jetackuu 2015-03-24 21:24:17
By Jetackuu 2015-03-24 21:24:47
Big government like the Bush expansion of Government power?
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-24 21:29:00
Big government like the Bush expansion of Government power?
Or the virtual suspension of the 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 9th, and 10th amendments?
Seriously, the only liberties that seem to matter these days are religion and guns...
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By Garuda.Chanti 2015-03-24 21:31:24
.... Back to the topic, I think Cruz is going to take some heavy hits due to his early announcement. I'm not sure it was a good strategy to be first. You assume he is running as a serious candidate?
Political handicappers rate his chances as slim to none. With most going for none.
I think at best he is positioning himself for a shot in 2020. But he could be angling for a job at Fox or with a foundation or think tank too.
Its OK, there is LOTS of room in the clown car.
....
Tea Party is a Party of Constitutional Conservatives with a taste of Libertarian. All we want is a strict following of the constitution.. We also want the Government to back the F off.... /rolleyes
There is nothing conservative about the tea party. You are a bunch of burn it down, temper tantrum throwing radicals.
To misquote Bender, libertarians my shiny metal ***. Yeah, you want the government out of the corporations and back in our bedrooms where it belongs.
Also all of your politicians are wholly owned subsidiaries of Koch Enterprises and most of your "grass roots" organizations pure astroturf.
This is something my conservative friends and I agree on BTW. I seem to know a few real conservatives.
But hey keep on believing.
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-24 21:31:49
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-24 21:33:31
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By Jetackuu 2015-03-24 21:34:12
Big government like the Bush expansion of Government power?
Or the virtual suspension of the 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 9th, and 10th amendments?
Seriously, the only liberties that seem to matter these days are religion and guns... Shootin' with Jesus!
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By Enuyasha 2015-03-24 21:34:49
geriatric death camps too? Oh boy, PROGRESS!
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-03-24 21:34:52
Big government like the Bush expansion of Government power?
Nice strawman, but nobody is defending Bush. It's 2015, we can stop defending Obama's every move by referencing Bush now.
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-24 21:35:42
Jesus loves guns. It's why it's in the constitution!
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-24 21:36:08
Big government like the Bush expansion of Government power?
Nice strawman, but nobody is defending Bush. It's 2015, we can stop defending Obama's every move by referencing Bush now.
I like how the Republican party seems to forget Bush or any of his staff were ever around but continues to push the same politics as if they weren't massive failures.
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-24 21:36:48
Man, there are people who defend bush on everything. Even in Canada!
I knew a bus driver who saw him as a visionary, even after I told her she was the one seeing things!
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By Jetackuu 2015-03-24 21:37:53
Big government like the Bush expansion of Government power?
Nice strawman, but nobody is defending Bush. It's 2015, we can stop defending Obama's every move by referencing Bush now. Um, that's not a strawman...
It was more of a joke anyway, not really an Obama defense, but people will still keep he's a socialist dictator Muslim from Kenya despite reality.
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Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-03-24 21:39:15
It's almost like it's the new Godwin, though. It's like complaining about eating haggis and having someone tell you that it's better than eating feces. Yes, that's true, but it's a stupid point to make in the first place.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-24 21:41:27
It's almost like it's the new Godwin, though. It's like complaining about eating haggis and having someone tell you that it's better than eating feces. Yes, that's true, but it's a stupid point to make in the first place.
It's the same logic that's applied to virtually every policy or figure from the opposing political party/ideology. Rather than evaluating politics and politicians on their merits and shortfalls, most people just revert to labels and talking points.
By Jetackuu 2015-03-24 21:42:26
It's almost like it's the new Godwin, though. It's like complaining about eating haggis and having someone tell you that it's better than eating feces. Yes, that's true, but it's a stupid point to make in the first place.
The original post I commented on was rather stupid, so it fit the puzzle quite nicely.
edit: Don't pick on the Scottish...
By Sayomi 2015-03-24 21:48:03
MSNBC-> HAY GAIZ BUSH BAD WE SRSLY!
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By Enuyasha 2015-03-24 21:53:45
OOOOOOH BUZZWORDS! WE CAN PLAY THIS GAME TOO! 9/11. Iraq Invasion. The Patriot Act. 9/11 First Responders Bill denied. Mission Accomplished. Wheres Waldo Osama Bin Laden Sadam.
By Bloodrose 2015-03-24 21:54:18
you forgot a 9/11 in there, bud.
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By Sayomi 2015-03-24 21:57:19
Too bad we didnt finish in Iraq and let Isis happen, thanks Obama, Libs/Dems. Oh and Benghazi!
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