For The Shinies! A Guide For Thief

Another dumb question, why is felistris the best TP headpiece? Wouldn't a DA+1~2 Iuitl Headgear be better?

Did you look at the stats before posting? Or did 1-2% DA start beating 2% tripple attack.

Did YOU look at the stats before posting?



Or did 2TA start beating 2TA+2DA?

Iuitl headgear +1 comes with 2%TA without augments so with a 2DA augment it completely smokes Felistris.

I figured as much. Just wondered why I hardly see it shown in spreadsheets and pretty much no THFs I see use it.

Prolly because some players are turned off by the augmenting system.

I'm obviously wrong and an *** hat, being flustered and not thinking about it. But if your spreadsheet says it wins, then why ask? It's the same reason I don't use Otronif +1 with 2% DA, spreadsheet says sao +1 feet win, just ignore what the meta says and trust the numbers on the damn spreadsheet.

Because there are many variables in the spreadsheet people, for some reason, often ignore and may want more feedback to make sure they may not be missing something (for example, perhaps one piece that appears weaker but is showing higher dps in the spreadsheet is only doing so because it's in a specific ratio zone or in the dDex sweet spot, which may not translate into a real-world scenario)

My spreadsheet said it was winning but idk if I was missing something with the atk/str/dex making it pull ahead(it doesn't).

To add to Llewelyn's post: since spreadsheets have to be updated manually for now, a person modifying them can make a minor error that throws everything off. A quick list of stuff that you'd have to update manually (as far as I know):

- new gear
- recent WS modifications
- 1-handed accuracy update
- job point/gift bonuses
- newer buff(s?) like Shiva's TP bonus

Not to mention the fact that the enemy list data is relatively limited (though do serve as excellent reference points). Skillchains have never been covered either (unless I've never noticed it), so there's bound to be some deviation from what the spreadsheet is going by.

Original motenten spreadsheet iuitl hadnt augments, but aside that, there are the 2 diferences that can make felistris pull ahead of iuitl even with +2 da.

First in case of dynamis zones, when you can cap pdif with rcb. In that case, with no external buffs, there were people who uses skadi body, and felistris pull ahead with the extra haste, though with my spreadsheet thaumas beats skadis in that situation, while skadi beats others 119 body even with uncapped haste. So, in case youre one of those that uses skadis, the extra 1 haste beats 2 da from iuitl. Obviously, with thaumas, iuitl will pull ahead felistris.

For situations like tojil with marchs, the extra 5 str and 10 attacks should pull ahead of 2 da.

EDIT: btw, thaumas just pull ahead skadi without buffs if you are gear haste uncapped with skadi. Suposing you can cap haste without body slot (without sacrificing patentia, because not using patentia for a haste belt is a dps waste, regardless), skadi will pull ahead of thaumas.

EDIT2: and if youre only worried about dps, and thaumas (gear haste capped), raiders head is superior (3 ta) than felistris. Obviously your def will take a huge drop.

EDIT3: considering those situations, thinking about dw, haste, da/ta, i made a dynamis solo set for thf. Rcb as food. In this set, dw beats da/ta in most situations and gives adorned helmet some use, though ejekamal with haste augment can reach same haste, and has 1 mdb more (att is irrelevant for dynamis), solely because of extra haste optimize the use of skadi body over thaumas. Funny thing is the neck piece. With skadi, the stp+2 from ocachi beats asperitys da+2 while with thaumas, da+2 beats stp+2, at least in my simulation. If not haverton, oneiros > rajas, but with rajas instead haverton/oneiros, asperity starts beating ocachi. I supose this set is too close to the limit where youre attacking so fast thats more profitable gaining more tp per hit than hitting more. Cape is suposed dw+3 but even unaugmented it beats vellanus (thats dw+2).

ItemSet 333236

EDIT4: small fix, but max dps in spreadsheet is reached by mainhanding atoyac (5 stp/oat) and jugo+1. Rudras potential will drop, but instead you will attack more and receive more tp per hit.

Is this just displaying all the different DW options?

This last set is the highest dps i could find in spreadsheet against dynamis. Its at 34% dw with canny at 3%, but it can go up to 5, and the more the merrier.

Haverton ring though, seems a rare choice for ring, so its reasonable dropping it for oneiros or raja. In that case, dw drops to 29% but the combo skadi and haste head still is higher than felistris and thaumas. Felistris and skadi will still be inferior choice while you cant cap haste without patentia. Patentia is too op at high dw, as it provides dw, that contributes more than haste, and stp, that contributes more than multi hit.

Iuitl +1 has the same haste as Felistris, unless I'm missing something...?

Though, the 11-haste heads are obviously still better in that scenario.

Youre correct. Its my spreadsheet that has the 7% haste value. I guess or i messed that value or motenten forgot to change haste when it was upgraded from iuitl nq (thats 7%).

How do you guys deal with various TP sets, given the varying levels and presence of march/haste/DW gear? Mote's gearswap doesnt seem to have defined sets to cycle through, and i was wondering if anyone painstakingly made a gearswap that has a buffactive rule similar to how many gearswaps auto detect AM3 and modify tp sets based on it. Would be cool for it to detect if you had haste,vs haste+march, vs haste+marchx2 and altered your DW gear accordingly. How do most thfs here deal with it, do you just cycle modes manually when buffs drop/dispelled/applied?

So basiclly in this care there is no such thing as ODing on DW? I thought 11% DW was plenty enough to reduce your delay?

There is certainly such a thing as "ODing on DW". If you stack more DW past the amount needed to hit delay reduction, it actually hurts your DPS because you won't be attacking any faster, but you *will* still be losing TP/hit.

11% DW is only for when you have capped magic and gear haste. However, in his Dynamis scenario, you could stack pretty much all the DW gear you want since it's impossible for THF to hit delay reduction cap without any forms of magic haste.

But the different sources of DW get confusing i.e suppa vs delve earrings vs sombra vs raiders boomerang vs skadi+1 etc. not sure when to use which given what buffs

So should i make a 0magic haste, mid magic haste, and capped magic haste Dw set?

Yes, if you want to maximize your performance in every situation. I would strongly suggest the DNC guide as a reference for magic haste values and necessary DW for them. The values are slightly different, as DNC gets DW4 over THFs DW3, but the general concept remains the same.

Basically: If you have capped magic haste use some combination of Patentia Sash, Augmented JSE Cape, and DW earrings. Personally I've found Suppa+Patentia+JSE to be the best for me. You need 11%.

If you don't have capped magic haste just stack DW in every reasonable slot. Unless you have that 11% Haste helm or in an Ionis zone, Skadi+1 is probably not reasonable because of uncapped haste.

Its not estrictly necessary the adorned helm to achieve 11% haste in head. Ejekamal can be augmented with +2% haste instead pdt/mdt. In the end, the diference between ejekamal with haste +2 and adorned is 1 mdb for the first and extra 22 def for the second. The diference in the others stats are pretty much irrelevant in a dynamis context.

okay cool, that makes sense.

Just a few DW thresholds to reach the delay cap, assuming you have your 25% gear haste:

- With no buffs: 74 total DW to cap.
- With Haste 1 only: 67 total DW to cap.
- With Haste 2 only: 56 DW to cap.
- With either Haste 1 + either both Marches (real BRDs) or GEO Haste, or Haste 2 and Victory March (real BRDs), or Haste 2 and both Marches (Trusts), you'll hit the magic haste cap: 36 total DW to cap.
- With capped magic haste and /DNC Haste Samba: 24 DW to cap (below our native amount, so no DW gear needed).

I'd add more, but I kinda feel like there are practically no situations where you'd get a weird combination of magic haste sources that don't add up to the magic haste cap, aside from getting hit by slow.

So when would it be optimal to use Raider's Boomerang? Even in Dyna, I think Xbow might win out just because of how awesome Sleep Bolts are for sleeping a mob for SA and blood bolts are better for cures without wasting TP. In party situations, having Raider's Boomerang keeps you from using WSing with Yetshila or Jukukik which could hurt DPS i assume?

Also why do some people use Quiahuiz for TP sets? Wouldn't Iuitl+1 with DA aug be better?

Your rudras should be one shotting mobs in dynamis without a ranged slot or SA, so boomarang is always optimal there.

Maybe they don't have those. But saying that, since Iuitl+1 only win with DA augment, what about Qaaxo Path A legs?

The Iuitl bring 5 STP to the table, which is really tough to ignore. Big boost there, especially with Rudra's scaling.