The Sealed Dagger: A Ninja Guide

RNG actually has two: Crossbow (Foret) and Bow (Kamihr).

But yeah, for weapon types there's Katana and Gun still lacking Naakual (WKR&Delve) boss drops, so NIN and COR as the only jobs without access to one.

It does stand to reason that the 7th Naakual referred to in storyline (and from stuff like the RoE menu calling the WKR Key Items the Seven treasures), if it gets a WKR and/or Delve version, would logically drop those weapon types. Hopefully having to wait for last means those 119 weapons will be really good.

FWIW, I'm also having an awful time of getting AA MR to drop the katana with lots and lots of tries... I'm sure I'll eventually get it when it's completely useless. For now, rocking a Kannakiri+2 (DMG+11 Acc+7 and DEX+something), along with an Isuka R15 path A.

Kik/shigi
Kannagi/shigi
Kik/Kannagi

You are saying that relic/empy combo provides the best dps?
What about those other 2 combos? Can anyone put those in a spreadsheet, I would be curious to see the results.

Yes, I have kannagi/kik coming ahead. Once I get back to my desk I will check to make sure I had proper buffs/ODD/AM up!

Kik main, Kannagi offhand? Also, just looking at the node, relic 119 body should beat af 119 for Hi. Anyone else agree?

Yup, relic 119 is what I'm using in body slot as well.

Kannagi and Kikoku should never be used as a set.

if only that att +40 counted in offhand /cry

Agreed. After reviewing my spreadsheet I noticed I had some funky mix of AM/ODD setting when i have both kik/kannagi on. But everything on the list of current katanas still is correct. Must have been one of my early morning brain farts.

Except that Kaitsuburi can be replaced with the new bayld katana (Senkutanto). Edit: Less accuracy (-15) and attack (-10), but more DMG and lower delay. Both Katanas are free.

1. RME
2. Raim.
3. Kannakiri +2
4. Isuka Path A/B
5. Shigi
6. Senkutanto
7. Pamun
8. Kaits.

Obviously that's main hand, just trying to figure out what wins with delay options and damage. For instance, would the lower delay on the shigi in offhand ever beat the raim over time?

Would kikoku119 with blade: hi dps get closer to kannagi 119 now? Or kannagi still win hand down?

I have a Kannagi 119 and my Blade:Hi's do a decent amount of damage. I'm not sure how much damage Kiko does, but according to my spreadsheet Kannagi beats Kiko by 35 damage. My spreadsheet might be wrong who knows. If my spreadsheet is right then there really isn't a big jump in damage. So if you have both Kiko and Kannagi 119 i would just go with Kiko just cause it does more DPS.

Will kikoku overall dps be close or same to kannagi after we sre given access to blade hi? I am not just asking abt the ws dmg alone. Sorry for the confusion

If you are in a situation where you can't WS or can't maintain at least AM1 with Kannagi, then Kikoku is better.

If you can maintain at least AM1, Kannagi is better.

Think you need more then am1, I have both at 119. Kannagi seems to fall short on parse almost every time. Now it's the question of 210/210 or 210/shigi for dps.

So are you sure you need more than AM1?

What weapons are you talking about in your 210/210 combo?

I'm assuming 210/210 is Kiko/Kannagi or Kannagi/Kiko. For DPS Kiko is going to be your main-hand. Raim is going to be your off-hand because Raim does more DPS than Shigi and Kannagi. So Kiko/Raim is going to be the best DPS combo. Kiko/Shigi just comes short and for Kiko/Kannagi is short from /Shigi. If you main-hand Kannagi then Kiko is going to be your best off-hand. Then it'll follow with Raim then Shigi. These are the DPS according to spreadsheet with no buff/no food/same gear/same race(I picked Tarutaru cause i'm a Tarutaru). Kiko/Raim = 705.082, Kiko/Shigi = 703.776, Kiko/Kannagi = 702.882. Kannagi/Kiko = 658.621, Kannagi/Raim = 646.459, Kannagi/Shigi = 641.187. So overall Kiko/Raim is going to be your best option when it comes to DPS. But personally Kiko/any of the 3 is good. If you like Shigi because of the low delay then go ahead and use it. And if you like Raim because of the damage then use it. And most of them come pretty close.

hi lilmartio,
does your spreadsheet include factors like kannagi ODD and kikoku occ. triple dmg?
or just the plain vanilla DMG on the katana?

Are you not including AM1 in your Kannagi comparisons? Last I checked, I always had Kannagi come ahead aside from 1 situation which was something like "no marches and uncapped attack".

For those of you claiming Kikoku/Kannagi is best combo, please share your spreadsheet with the rest of us. :>

The spreadsheet i'm currently using is from Motenten. Can find the spreadsheet from this guide going towards VII Gear Sets. And i didn't include AM1 because wanted to try to answer Twignberries's question which was "210/210 or 210/Shigi for DPS". So i just went with no buffs/no food/same set/same race to give it a even playing field. And just see the meleeing portion before wsing and getting the effect from AMs.

that broke my heart a little, so kannagi with AM1 will beat kikoku unless uncapped and no buff.......

Kannagi looks cooler anyway.

I haven't looked at the newest version of the NIN spreadsheet, but the last one I had did not attribute COR buffs correctly for Set 2 TP or WS.

For me, I'll always be a Kikoku purist.

I rarely ever account for COR buffs in my spreadsheet comparisons since I almost never have them. :(

I only mention because if you're using COR buffs to cap cRatio for comparisons then take note because it's not applying correctly.

In fact, just downloaded a fresh NIN sheet, and it's still giving the #REF when using it. Takes a few moments to fix yourself if you care enough.

So far after going over Motes spreadsheet to determine if there are no incorrect references to data fields these are my results for Kannagi and Kikoku's comparisons.

Target Delve Fodder
Haste: 15% from Spell (Varying haste should only inflate the discrepancy here since both katana setups gain TP at the same value for dropping various dual wield values)
Capped cRatio
Capped Acc
Blade: Hi for both Katanas

Kannagi/Shigi ahead of Kannagi/Raimitsukane both ahead of-
Kikoku/Shigi ahead of Kikoku/Raimitsukane

The differences here between shigi and raimitsukane here are very very minor. Obviously in a situation where the added DEX bonus from Raimitsukane aren't realized we don't see any added damage. Which is also the case with kikoku's added 40 attack. It's making no difference.

I see these two katanas as nearly identical in terms of damage output with Kannagi obviously winning provided you're aggressive and on point with keeping ODD active. And when you gain nothing from an additional 40 attack.

Still, knowing this, I favor Kikoku, because it's triple damage is not associated with a weaponskill. And should any crit-evasive buttwads show their ugly face again. I won't have to depend on- I'll just job change, who am I kidding.

Additional buffs like Innin/Haste/etc should only inflate the discrepancy between the sets.

This is the truth! This is my belief!...At least for now.

So in conclusion, kannagi/shigi w/am1 with beat everyother combo atm.

Should also look into Qaaxo Body R15 A.
Or an Otronif +1 with 2% crit augment.

Uhh, I didn't say that? Maybe in some VERY remote case the 12 added dex will magically push you above Shigi's damage. But I can't find that case to save my life.

So as I was saying, I see Shigi beating Raimitsukane offhand.
Also note that I'm only comparing 4 different sets. Not all sets. (Excluding Nagi - lol)