Best Dagger For Thief

I'm actually curious as to how good this dagger is for THF compared to a str thokcha.

I deleted about ten smart *** replies to this and keep coming back to 'ol faithful: wtf? Anyway...

With my gear sets and normal buffs for a THF in a THF+DNC duo in Dyna:
Pugi is winning by 0.3%

With artificially capped attack:
Pugi is winning by 4%

With an artificial attack penalty of -100:
Pugi is losing by 0.2%

So like I implied in the invisible post above, its relative strength is tied to how much you need the lost stats on STR Thokcha.

Ok TY! I'm not sad over not bidding on it in legion the other day then ^-^

I would be a bit sad. :p

~4% is a nice chunk if you can manage to cap your attack. It sounds small but most of these hair-splitting gear comparisons come down to a lot of small-but-cumulative gains like that.

When exactly are you going to be capping your attack on THF . . .

Yeah, I only use THF for solo/duo and dyna farming.

You should be capped in Salvage, cap pretty easily on Dyna EP, and cap on Dyna DC sometimes with some work (some combination of steps and acid bolts with RCB, Mandau and Fire thokcha). Since these are the circumstances when I primarily use my THF, they are most relevant for me and I try to be diligent about mentioning the context whenever I make suggestions.

It dropped again and I won it, going to try it out tonight in dynamis hopefully!

Unrelated, kind of, but I do have a question about nef collar/rancor mantle. Is the dmg increase in using nefer/rancor mantle or rancor collar ever worth taking 10% more dmg, therefor needing to cure yourself more(wasting tp), and having a higher chance of dying? This is as THF/DNC, duo with a blu, usually fighting DC's in dyna or doing campaign/missions, nothing very difficult. I currently use atheling/agasaya's collar for TP.

Grats on the knife!

And I think you'll find that if you switch to using the rancor items that you won't notice much of a difference. The main problem enemies for Valkurm (where we generally farm) are funguar and the occasional RNG beastmen. For shrooms, I try to MDT swap their moves and for the RNG mobs, I usually just fulltime PDT until proc'd. We also almost always fight Cactus for coins now using the TP control strategy (fight to ~85%, turn until proc'd, kill before unproc) and I generally just wear PDT until they are proc'd. If we get a ton of links, I use pdt there too.

The general theme for rancor items goes like this: if the rancor item is actually dangerous for you to use, you should probably be temporarily using some kind of DT- set anyway, so with appropriate swaps you can capitalize on the benefit while minimizing the penalty.

returnign to this thread

im now using mandau95 for main and twatwasher 90 for offhand.
any new/other dagger that will improve dmg?

im using thief mostly inside aby or dynamis. (no food generally)
no merrited dagger skill so its purely evisceration for dmg ws

With no food, you'd benefit greatly from an Attack dagger. Try out an Aluh offhand to Mandau and see what you think.

Again in your opinion as second hand off mandau, asteria or str trials?

Unless the "Occasionally" effect is more frequent on Asteria than Supernal Knife, I'd side with Aluh. Better DPS after you factor in fSTR, 1% more Crit Hit Damage on average, STR for Mercy Stroke, and attack for AGI heavy Exen sets.

Been playing around with daggers. I don't know if I'm forgetting something or inputting something incorrectly, but I'm getting Coruscanti beating Aluh/STR for offhand on higher level stuff like VW and such. I guess this means I should take it if I ever see it?

I guess some people would prefer the 7M+ but I personally don't have much to get with gil anymore.

I think it's better than that combo. But if gil isn't a problem for you, buy currency for a Mandau. (I think at least '-')

Sorry, I guess I wrote that too vaguely, I meant it beat out Aluh or STR for offhand, I had Twash stuck in the mainhand. The DEX+15 is probably a big deal for Rudra's Storm. I imagine Aluh or STR will beat Coruscanti if you're using Mandau.

When I'm doing Dynamis I use Oynos Knife offhand till it procs then I switch to Aluh. Anytime i'm around a mage for haste I use aluh offhand. This is my tp set with the obvious main being mandau and off being aluh not other way around and I still use love torque cause I can't give it up, we've been through a lot ^^

I'm not sure if Mot updated his spreadsheet to reflect Sylow's initial findings. And as far as I know, Coruscanti wasn't re-tested since they fixed the problem where it was only triggering on the subsequent hits of multi-attack rounds (pretty sure I got that right?) so that's probably not in the spreadsheet either.

With Braver's, Twashtar(90) and Coruscanti, that's +45 dex without the rest of oyur gear so it wouldn't surprise me if Coruscanti was giving you +15% crit total or something ridiculous like that. /thinkingoutloud

Edit: Decided to unlazy...

- I don't see any accounting for Coruscanti's special thingy in there

- If 120 AGI is correct for Qilin and you're Mithra with DEX merits, the 4/5 Thaumas set with Braver's/Twash/Coruscanti, Coruscanti's giving you 8% dDEX crit on top of its 5%, so 13%. I still just see Coruscanti tied with Fire though, with Pugi about 3% ahead with the same buffs (goooo Pugi!). I kinda wondered if all of this crit would make Evisceration strong but it doesn't look like it. /morethinkingoutloud

Yeah I
Haven't
...
Gotten around to? Felt like? Had the motivation to? Cared enough to?

Retest Coruscanti.

Outside of abys mandu and str dagger ftw no other dagger.

Yeah I pretty much screwed with Coruscanti not even taking into account the randomly capped pDIF that it does, probably would push it even higher on those harder enemies, given that's the only place I had it winning. Also it's worth noting that it was only losing by 3 DPS (About 1-2%) on DC Nightmares for me, so even on weak stuff it's not a horrible choice or anything.

I might get a Mandau eventually, but that's a far ways off and Qilin is done pretty often so I was just contemplating whether I should take the dagger or the cell if I happened to come across it. I think I'd take it.

It also has the added advantage of looking very, very snazzy! That's the most important thing, duh.

I've seen a few Love Torques being used, just curious as to if that beats out Agasaya's ATK+8 and ACC+8 being that Love is DEF5 and Dagger Skill +7?

I do like the new Limbus and Nyzul gear, need to get my *** motivated and do some runs.

its DEX not def on love torque, thats why its still used. It can raise your crit hitrate. The closer you get to 50 dex over your mobs agi the more crit this will give you. But both Love and Agasaya are beaten by Rancor collar. But if you wont use that, then its in general Love > Agasaya. 7 Skill are equal to 7 att and like 6 acc + the acc from dex. so they are kinda equal att/acc wise, love just tops it with crit hitrate through dex.

My bad, yeah DEX, derped again. I have a Rancor Collar, use it to WS in for Evisc, but I don't main it. Thanks for the info, makes more sense now to get a Love Torque :)

where that oxossi dagger drop from, just noticed it today, mad late ofc

They are crafted IIRC 100+ BC, you can find them on AH

Stop using Rancor Collar.

Nefarious Collar for TP. Justiciar's Torque for Evisceration. Use Rancorous Mantle. Rancor Collar+Atheling only if you need the 6 Acc.

The reasons other jobs benefit from Rancor+Atheling more than Nefarious+Rancorous is because they don't have high base Triple Attack and 4 tiers of Critical Damage+ traits.

Edit: Ok so 3 months late but whatever.

It seems as though you're making a case for diminishing returns in Critical Hit Rate+, which, ok.

But your alternative is....a critical hit rate neck that has a lower percentage.


What?

They mean the Rancor back and nef neck over rancor neck and atheling back. More crit less da basically.

It's not just DA, it's a significant amount of ATK+

Would love to see some math from the person.