Evis -vs- Exten

Are you only thinking about thokcha dnc and thf lol?

No? You act like twashtar does something for Exenterator.

But if you mean Evisceration

((48+13+(176*.3*.85))*5)*3 + ((47+13+(176*.3*.85))*1)*3 = 1902

1902*1.22 = 2320

K you have to remember Dnc can self sc every 30 seconds. So what becomes more potent? The 1800 exent with like 1100 fragmentation or the evisceration dark SC. It's situational. And yes your going to do higher exent damage with agi thokcha if thats what im assuming your using? But this is about exent and evisceration. You HAVE to factor in more than just single ws dmg.

All I need to do is get athos body, the rest I all have. But then I got twashtar and exent just seems useless lol.

*1.25, not 1.22, You probably forgot the last tier crit atk bonus DNC got.

And your base crit rate is 46% not 41% (3 Athos = 4%, rancor = 5%, Kacura +1 = 2%, Base 100TP = 10%, dDEX+merit = 25%)

I didn't use berserk for the sake of consistency.

At best, the difference is ~200 damage (1742 vs 1950), not counting the crit boost with 3FM Building Flourish. I know you will score higher easier once you get DA/TA, but when there's a single miss on Exenterator, the damage dip quite a bit too.

The difference is little compared the other upgrade I had from:
- Vorpal Blade to CDC
- Slug Shot to Last Stand
- Gekko to Shoha

STR Thokcha first of all. And if it's about exent and evisceration, then no, all i have to do is single WS damage.

Forgot DNC had crit attack boost 3 at 99. Still doesn't change much, and still would be 41% crit rate. And I forgot rancor collar, so 46% even though I still did math for 50% crit rate.

((47+13+(161*.3*.85))*6)*3 = 1818

1818 * 1.25 crit damage = 2272

Now with 50% crit rate?

((47+13+(161*.3*.85))*6)*2 = 1212

(1212 + 2272)/2 = 1742 with 50% crit rate after 25% crit damage.

And I'm not telling you to merit exenterator, but that's over 15% increase in WS damage, with capped attack.

STill i get better results doing SC like dnc was meant to lol. Exent has better damage alone, but is not even close to rudra/evis combo, even evis/pyrr with a good set.

Well I already merit Exenterator because the other merited WS is crappy for my 4 jobs. The thing is I'd like to see the bigger picture.

There are many WS upgrades worth the hype like those 3 I mentioned. Evisceration to Exenterator, in the other hand seems pale.

I didn't try Requiescat and don't have NIN leveled. But if I may guess Vorpal Blade -> Requiescat and Jin->Shun upgrade is about the same magnitude of improvement you see from Evisceration->Exenterator. Slight edge, but not domination.

I wouldn't really lump Exenterator in the same category as Requiescat and Blade: Shun. Almace and Kannagi both make their weapon category's merit WS fairly useless(the former notwithstanding if you do a lot of Pil, I suppose). Even with a Twashtar, Exenterator is a top contender. What's better, both weapons are pitifully easy to make these days.

Uhhh.. you're comparing different stuff here, unless you meant to write Rudra's Storm, not Twashtar.

Well out of 1-hander Empy WS, I see Twashtar's Rudra is the weakest among other WS (Hi, CDC, and Victory Smite) due to :
- Demand for forced crit JA, making its spike damage not spammable. Although you can argue stuff like DEX bonus for SA and AGI bonus from TA, and 20% crit bonus from Charis Tiara +2 during activation of these JA.
- 1.0 fTP lower at base TP, making TP bonus offhand somewhat necessary.
- lowest base damage
So it's probably easier for Exenterator to close this gap, compared to the gap from Requiescat to CDC and Shun to Hi.

Rudra is more meant to aftermath lvl 3 with big spike and then go to your SCing for 90 seconds until its available again. It works wonders with dnc attack speed via saber dance/hastesamba/haste and a good tp set.

You mean Twashtar :P
Because Daka +2 doesn't give Aftermath.

Which I agree with you in that point.

No, please, continue posting nothing but clarifying what was already extremely obvious.

What are you fighting that allows you to fully utilize 90 seconds of aftermath that allows you to constantly self skillchain?

Voidwatch?

You can self skillchain in voidwatch?

I do it all the time!

lol this kid

Woah now, that's heresy around these here parts. Just wait until Asym sees this >:

I MUST ADD SOMETHING THEN!


loldnc.

What the *** happened while I was asleep.

I go to bed early for ONCE and the Dancer forums explode...with this thread!

I'll reply to this thread with useful stuff soon when I'm more awake, but JFC.

Reply #1:

Proper way to utilize RS in Voidwatch:

1.) 300 TP, 5 FMs before fight, Buffs/Temps etc.
2.) Climactic Flourish
3.) Presto/Box Step
4.) Rudra's Storm
5.) Dusty Wing
6.) Rudra's Storm
7.) Reverse Flourish
8.) Rudra's Storm
9.) Dusty Wing (if Refreshed)
10.) Rudra's Storm (if 9 is applicable)
11.) Climactic Wears
12.) Fanatics Wears
13.) Die

#2.) Evisceration doesn't just beat Exenterator when you have Champions up in VW, it also shits on it, unless you have Chaos Roll or Minuets or something.

You can also make Exent win by popping Building Flourish.

But the usefulness of that is dubious.

I realize it was noted implicitly alright, but for reiteration, mapping your limited merit WS spaces around a job that really doesn't belong in VW is pretty silly.

I will do whatever the *** event I want to do on whatever the *** job I want to do it on :P

Also, you can pretty much fulltime champions in VW, so you're going to be using Evisceration there more often anyway, the real kicker is how much more efficient Exenterator makes you in DNC's shining star diva event, Dynamis.

That said, you'll take me to VW on DNC, and you'll like it.

Which is perfectly fine, as long as the less knowledgeable majority of the forum is aware that it's a pretty backwards way to prioritize.

When people ask about questions for a specific job, I'm going to answer questions about that specific job. I assume that if you're asking optimization questions for a specific job, it's important enough to you to make sacrifices in order to optimize it.

If someone asks me, I have Relic RNG, COR, Ragnarok WAR/DRK +Ukonvasara, SAM, and DNC/THF with Mandau, which WS should I merit?

Okay, then I'll tell them that maybe they'll just have to go without Exenterator.

That said, this person asked about Evisceration vs. Exenterator for Dancer.

Exenterator is clearly the superior choice (except for the mentioned conditions)

Also, I don't really know where the "Prioritizing merits for VW" came from when I think it's been clearly stated that most of the time Exenterator won't be the best choice for Voidwatch due to Champion's. In fact that's really the only discussion of Voidwatch besides me pointing out that you can use Rudra's Storm multiple times with one climactic due to temps.

The rest of the discussion has been about .. uh ... Campaign? lol

The issue of potentially misleading prioritization stems from stressing Evisceration's edge over Exenterator in an event where dancer is pretty irrelevant. It's worth noting, to be sure, but so is the bigger picture.

And the explicit discussion of a single job is fine and dandy, but don't insult my intelligence by pretending it wasn't an outlet to quell your dancer is better than everyone else itch. You love dancer, and that's great, but attempt to speak without bias.

Exenterator is one of the best merit WS options.