"BLM Frame Can't Out Nuke A Real BLM"

I get in trouble because people tend to forget that these forums are meant to be for information sharing, not for winning popularity contests. You contribute virtually nothing to this website, outside of demonstrating how to kill something by spamming pet food and dawn mulsum, and I'd be absolutely taken back by anyone(other than you) arguing to the contrary.

It's just weird, SCH does a bunch of stuff. To do stuff you need stratagems usually, and consuming 2 stratagems for one nuke is a lot. At 90 they get 5 stratagems that recharge every 0:48, I'm not sure what they have at 95. So consuming 2 is a lot, so depending on what you're doing it's probably not worth it, I dunno.

I guess if I cared more about SCH I'd care more about figuring that out. >_>; For everything I'd use SCH for, I have WHM, and my mule(that's really Night's but w/e) has RDM and BLM. :/

I havn't had the need of macc that badly on sch actually, every once in a while my helix gets resisted which sucks but, i'd rather use 1 strategem on embulence then 2 on macc+25.. even tho macc+25 is pretty sexy i usually dont need it.

I suppose its also largely dependent on your situation. Everyone knows I usually lowman VW(4-5 characters max, among 2-3 people playing them), so the most important thing is that we can deal enough damage to kill the thing while not causing positioning issues(because we have virtually no backup option if there's a death). That said, I'd be doing whatever I could do minimize SCH's enmity generated by damage, and maximizing helix output.

At least SCH has basically the best 2hr in the game at this point.
Of course most 2hrs are irrelevant or mediocre at this point, so it's like being the straightest guy in the locker room at the ice capades.

No argument there. TR is a monster in any situation that you can manipulate its duration(or just at its base, in regard to zergs).

Still doesn't mean this thread should be about sch vs blm. Again.

So anyway, pup nukes are awesome and such.

Yeah I agree. Now I'm confused about everything though are we talking about Meritting Focalization (Dark Arts Stratagem (requires two charges). Increases the accuracy of your next black magic spell.) or Equanimity (Dark Arts Stratagem (requires two charges). Your next black magic spell will generate less enmity.)? I'm assuming Equanimity, just because I could see the enmity- being useful, but not specifically.

I also don't feel like you'd take SCH to Voidwatch in a lowman situation either though. D:<


Trueee... but I still don't see people picking me as the SCH. :( /emo

Dont forget sch can cast pax on itself, i dunno how much -enmity you need but pax and Equanimity dont stack. I also dont' know ho wmuch -enmity pax is.

Oh... true. Equanimity is -50 enm fully meritted, and Pax is -10 enm, apparently.

quoting as a i go (was creating a set for someone)

this, its black and white as dnc's group 1 merits, if you merit something else, you are doing it wrong.


true there are times where your target will do something that will *** anybody up, but understand that in my personal case, you have a full stoneskin (which alone is a major benefit) phalanx'ga (useless to some, but talk it down all you want, damage- is damage-) pro/shell, Na's and DT gear that could rival a pld. but as ninian said it could be a race thing (never understood why there are taru pld)

helix: mb'd helices are the way to go, but yeah you do a substantial amount of dmg with them alone.

whm part: yes mp could be an issue if every one was getting their *** handed to them, but in cases when that is not an issue mp reeeeaaallly isnt a gigantic problem, i do remember my last fight with kaggen where i used 5 ethers, 4 sublimations, and 2 verts just to keep up with curing and we had 2 whm, a rdm, 2 sch (emanuelle was there as well)


you're an *** but we love you all the same, but yeah you said it, you would be less inclined to heal the mages, so if a sch pulls hate (which he/she should be running to the tank at that point) the sch would be less inclined to die, than say blm since this is the current argument i guess, because he/she can cure itself effectively.


/rdm only, unless you're on stun detail. i never saw using haste on sch being all to valid considering there is usually a whm there to begin with and will continue to be there as long as sch's top cure is c4. and you wont need enlight for dispell if you are /rdm.










you're fine, equanimity is just bad, nevermind losing stormsurge or losing enlight, it also requires 2 strategems to just give you -50 enmity on what spell you're going to use, thats if you max it out.



sorry long post, didnt forsee it taking that long.

we shall see with the magian staves +3, if they eliminate macc completely on them im not going further and just leaving them at +2 though.

Or you can make TWO damage staves one +2 one +3! ENJOY YOUR WASTE OF TIME AND INVENTORY SPACE D:<

But no really if they get rid of the macc on +3... just... ugh.

i loved TR even before the changes and new spells, adding them just made me wet myself




i've been using TR as a bribe lately to get into things like AV shouts or VW shouts lol.

i already enfeeble with alky >.>;;;;

Embrava with Perpetuance is insane.

I still use HQ staves.... dont judge me >>

better than nuking with siriti~

12 minutes of rape.

use it at the beginning of tabula rasa, then perpectuance w/ af+2 hands at the end for ~15.5 min of rape

Sounds like what I do with SV and Night/Troub. :o

lets be real tho, like anything would last 15 min of embrava anyway

im 5 storm surge , 1 enligh/ 4 equanimity, enlight is only for emergencies , for reraise or stoneskin cure4 or -na spells, i hardly use it, if i want to sleep something i just cast it since light arts does get enfeebling to b+ rate too (assuming it's an emergency) it's not like you will waste enlight for sleep only anyways, it's a waste of a 5 mins recast, it's better to use it on something more important, i mentioned equanimity only to compare it to Enmity Douse for extra hateless dmg. 2 stratagems doesn't hurt when your purely doing xtra dmg/chaining nukes to avoid getting hate

I know several people that enjoy playing pup. I imagine it's a fun job. For them. To each their own. But for a Pup to insist they can out-nuke a pro Blm is foolhardy, at best. It's like a Sch claiming they can out heal a career Whm. Or, a Pup, making the same claim.

For the sake of comparison,

Enmity Douse gives an indiscriminate 800/sec while operating under the ~8000 damage it takes for a BLM to cap CE, and the ~2000 damage it takes to cap VE. Ignoring ED, that means that, while maintaining proper positioning, you're afforded an ~8000 damage window in which you absolutely will not take hate off of a tank with expectant CE/VE levels. After that point, you're given a window of ~1000/minute while not drawing attention. ED is going to reset both of these windows, essentially handing you an additional window to deal that same 8000 damage before you reenter the 1000/min threshold(which numerically means 1800/min total).

A SCH starts off with the same initial boundary, and ends up adhering to the same 1000/min rule thereafter. Fully merited Equanimity, which can be used roughly 6 times every 10 minutes(lined up with ED for ease of comparison), is going to reduce 6 of your spells by ~50% every 10 minutes. I say about 50% because of the multiplicative interaction with equipment/status enmity reduction. Assuming your damage is roughly 1000/spell(again, for simplicity), that's 6000 damage every 10 minutes that's being reduced. 6000 damage is going to result in ~7500 CE, so reduce that by half, and you've got your additional threshold for damage/minute, which in this case, in total, would be 1375/min.

Before helices are considered, BLM deals roughly 425 DPM more than SCH, which is a fairly large advantage.

Things to note:

* While not often practiced, it is most efficient to cast offensive spells in -50 enmity. That means Equanimity is half as effective(CE(0.50 x 0.50), while ED remains the same.

* Helices bring additional damage to the table if viable, but it isn't likely going to tip the scales that greatly.

* BLM is still significantly better for procs.

* BLM has stun, which is always useful, while SCH's ability to switch to a healing role not only requires that they temporarily/indefinitely stop dealing damage, but that they further increase their enmity.

Edit: And just for clarity, this is less about who's a better long-term DD, and much more about the viability of Equanimity. I'd say that if you're one of those people who plays a so-so job in serious situations just because they enjoy it, and you're interested in bringing the best performance out of it, its not a bad thing to merit. If you find yourself in a situation where you're constantly using Enlightenment, I suppose it has merit, but I don't necessarily feel as if its that defensively beneficial.

Edit2.0: Last bit! Promise! I understand the appeal of things like Parsimony/Ebullience, but try to keep in mind that, while much easier on your stratagem timer, they're really nothing but MP-savers. You'll do more damage over time by reducing your CE.

Wish people would give PUP an try and learn how the job works rather than popping in like this. (And before anyone jumps on me for saying this without having BLM leveled, my second account is BLM95. Only thing "bad" about it would be I still have moldy/hecate instead of Novio/Hecate.)

Also, no PUP would make that WHM claim btw since the AI system makes it so -na comes before Cures. And the time between cures for a party set up IT~NM would be murder (Unless it's like a duo of nin + pup >.>)

a good sch doesnt have the charges to waste on a single spell producing -50 enmity...

i do, 48 secs of stratagems recharges <3, i dont even use equanimity was just putting that to compare it vs Enmity Douse

Then you're using your stratagems wrong, and making a mockery of the job
Not exactly a shocking concept in your case, as I think we've all found