SA TA SATA Suggestions

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SA TA SATA suggestions
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By 2011-05-03 17:34:43
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 Bahamut.Wakabo
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By Bahamut.Wakabo 2011-05-03 17:36:35
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Aias bonnet
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2011-05-03 17:40:33
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If you have Raider's boomerang then don't use tathlum, the TP loss swapping back to rang hurts more than the 5% crit dmg. That and using SA/TA together is pretty weak post 60
[+]
 
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By 2011-05-03 17:40:46
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 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2011-05-03 17:45:31
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Bismarck.Josiahfk said:
That bonnet would definitely not be worthwhile in SATA, you mean SA?

if you meant SA only then we're trading +1 dmg in weapon for 8 STR. is that worthwhile in abyssea? I figured no for a SA macro hmmm

1fSTR is 1DMG, Aias will add 2 at best if applicable, it'll break down to the gained attack vs 1D in most cases.
 
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By 2011-05-03 17:47:31
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By 2011-05-03 17:54:17
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By 2011-05-03 17:57:16
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By 2011-05-03 17:59:55
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By 2011-05-03 23:54:19
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 Phoenix.Kirana
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By Phoenix.Kirana 2011-05-04 00:05:14
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May I ask what your reasoning is behind using SA and TA together? The only reason I can see for doing this is to get some epeen high number on a single WS. Splitting it will give you higher damage overall.

I suppose you could argue that it's useful when sticking hate on a tank, but who uses tanks anymore?
 
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By 2011-05-04 00:24:18
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 Asura.Karbuncle
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By Asura.Karbuncle 2011-05-04 12:34:35
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Are these solo SA or TA sets or actual SAWS TAWS or SATAWS sets?

if its solo TA and SA, does factoring in the loss of DPS just not matter to anyone anymore >___>? Or is that moot in abyssea due to massive Crit+DMG out-weighing the maintained balance of SA/TA DPS.
 Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2011-05-04 12:43:58
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tumbler trunks or heca pants if you need attack. if you're short on str then heca boots give str/dex for sata.

also on a side note: i almost typed "+2 those rogue gloves"
it's been a long day, gentlemen.
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By Catsby 2011-05-04 12:46:35
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Look like pretty sweet sets to me. I haven't done a SATA combo since that trait that changed TA was introduced. In my opinion it's best to keep them separate for the TH building and dropping weaker mobs faster.
 
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By 2011-05-04 13:59:24
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By 2011-05-04 14:08:19
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 Cerberus.Zandra
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By Cerberus.Zandra 2011-05-04 14:16:54
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Asura.Karbuncle said:
Are these solo SA or TA sets or actual SAWS TAWS or SATAWS sets?

if its solo TA and SA, does factoring in the loss of DPS just not matter to anyone anymore >___>? Or is that moot in abyssea due to massive Crit+DMG out-weighing the maintained balance of SA/TA DPS.


Thf is my newest job, so forgive me if I'm overlooking something but why wouldn't you just WS in the TA or SA gear? Assuming of course that you've filled as many slots as possible with the swap?
 Asura.Karbuncle
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By Asura.Karbuncle 2011-05-04 14:27:12
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Cerberus.Zandra said:
Asura.Karbuncle said:
Are these solo SA or TA sets or actual SAWS TAWS or SATAWS sets?

if its solo TA and SA, does factoring in the loss of DPS just not matter to anyone anymore >___>? Or is that moot in abyssea due to massive Crit+DMG out-weighing the maintained balance of SA/TA DPS.


Thf is my newest job, so forgive me if I'm overlooking something but why wouldn't you just WS in the TA or SA gear? Assuming of course that you've filled as many slots as possible with the swap?

I mean Stand-alone SA or TA. Without WS is what i was talking about.

The way it works is, When you got to SA or TA, If you completely swap out your gear/armor for SA, You lose your ~30/40% haste/dual wield for 1 Attack round. While its not major, doing it twice every 1 minute it'd add up over time.

So in the old days, People would combine highest DEX/AGI (depending) as well as maintain a solid DPS value to maximum over-all DPS and the Damage of SA/TA.

So you has a SA set, and a SAWS set. Where as the SA set maintained a high DPS Value (Kept Haste near cap/etc) while the SAWS was pure Stats.

Find a better explination somewhere here:

http://shamayaasura.livejournal.com/

Wondering if this practice is moot these days. The blog post is a year or two old, So it may have changed and i just missed it x.x

Bismarck.Josiahfk said:
Asura.Karbuncle said:
Are these solo SA or TA sets or actual SAWS TAWS or SATAWS sets?

if its solo TA and SA, does factoring in the loss of DPS just not matter to anyone anymore >___>? Or is that moot in abyssea due to massive Crit+DMG out-weighing the maintained balance of SA/TA DPS.
None of this is ws sets no, they'd be seperate. and yeah if your group is killing a mob in 5 seconds and taking 2 seconds to pull, a TA at the start or SATA Hide or SA hide can make a difference in kill speed without needing to take time for placement

Like I said earlier this is just gearsets to maximize certain job abilities. I'm not saying we all need to SA TA and SATA all the time etc

Are you quoting the wrong person or do you not understand What I'm saying >___>? Read what i wrote above. I tried to explain it better.

Sorry if i was unclear the first time.
 
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By 2011-05-04 14:38:24
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 Asura.Karbuncle
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By Asura.Karbuncle 2011-05-04 14:44:48
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Bismarck.Josiahfk said:
I think I missed your point Carbuncle yeah. You're wondering if the extra dmg done by swapping gear for a SA or TA isn't worth the slight slowdown in dps because one attack round doesn't have the haste/dual weild? Assuming we're fighting a single mob and constantly SA TA that same mob?

hmmm that's a good question. For outside exping or cruoring either I'm usually fighting a NM solo tanking and cant SA TA or I'm there to proc TH higher in which dual wielding would slow down attack speed anyways.

But mathematically I couldn't tell you parse wise if all this gear swapping for extra dmg is worth or not worth sacrificing one attack round's haste. That's interesting though lol

I'll try a SATA in capped haste gear then try it in my SATA build and see if every 1 minute over time the dmg difference is worth the loss

Yeah, You'd still switch a few things (Rings, Earrings, back, etc, things that dont have haste/dual wield on them).

There are also some cases where the bonuses far outweigh the over-all DPS gained. For instance, Loki's Kaftan would be the best regardless.

Or something like Empyrean+2 Hands would out-weigh haste gloves in that slot for SA.

It was complicated :( The blog i linked you too has a really good explanation in it somewhere. its a few years out-dated which is why I'm asking if the ideas in it have changed or become out-dated.
 
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By 2011-05-04 14:50:12
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 Cerberus.Zandra
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By Cerberus.Zandra 2011-05-04 15:01:43
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Theory makes prefect sense, stat bonuses on gear are bigger which makes the full swap point more credible, BUT considering that players have MUCH MORE Haste/DA/TA & DW options now than before it would be my guess that the argument for two separate sets is stronger now than then.

Anyone know a rough estimate as to the proportional difference between the total dmg in a regular att round vs S/T attack round inside vs outside abyssea? I would think that the difference between the two is greater outside abyssea than it is inside.
 
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By 2011-05-04 15:16:49
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 Cerberus.Zandra
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By Cerberus.Zandra 2011-05-04 15:44:48
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Cavaros Mantle too
 
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By 2011-05-04 16:04:40
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 Remora.Laphine
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By Remora.Laphine 2011-05-04 16:08:03
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It's actually the other way around today. Since we have so much haste/dw/da/ta, sa/ta got devalued because we do a lot of damage while they are down, and so, its final contribution to our damage is much lower than what it was at 75.

If you are curious about delay/haste on sa/ta you can check this spreadsheet. It's mathed out nicely there.
 
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By 2011-05-04 16:28:55
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 Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2011-05-04 16:33:18
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Bismarck.Josiahfk said:
Ragnarok.Ashman said:
tumbler trunks or heca pants if you need attack. if you're short on str then heca boots give str/dex for sata.

also on a side note: i almost typed "+2 those rogue gloves"
it's been a long day, gentlemen.
Heca feet +1? the Lithe boots give Dmg+12 in which you're trading Dmg+8 on a weapon for STR+7 in wearing those? -_- that's a huge decrease in SATA dmg

Sorry, I haven't used my thf much since rushing it to 90. I didn't even look closely at those boots :x

Also, see this for additional details:

Ragnarok.Ashman said:

also on a side note: i almost typed "+2 those rogue gloves"
it's been a long day, gentlemen.
 Sylph.Malizia
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By Sylph.Malizia 2011-05-04 16:45:55
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Bismarck.Josiahfk said:

Nah it counts all your DEX and AGI thats why I bothered separating. Don't you notice when SA does ~2000 and SATA does ~3000 > <

Huh, my solo SA's and TA's only hit about 1000. What am I doing wrong? I'm using RR/GH/Apoc for atmas, and these for my SA and TA set:




Looks like I've got 18 less DEX and 30 less AGI than you, and no Loki's Kaftan for crit. I'm also mainhanding Twilight Knife (on purpose) so that's less damage. But 1000 less damage? Seems odd...
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