Free Will Or Determinism

Wow there are some major science misconceptions in this post :|

QM is a deterministic theory: you won't find any stochastic DEs in any of its equations and every wavefunction (or field configuration, in QFT) evolves uniquely in time under a given Hamiltonian. The probability comes in solely from measurements due to entanglement with the environment and decoherence. It's silly to point to QM as proof that "the universe isn't deterministic," because, well, the theory doesn't say that at all.

Dark matter has not been detected (although a facility in Minnesota maybe came close) and that's because WIMPs -- which is what we think dark matter is made of -- only interact through the weak nuclear force (well, aside from gravity)...which is pretty weak.

I'm not sure what *any* of this has to do with free-will, determinism or consciousness. There's some major confusion floating around here.

"Believes" Eh? Guns make a "bang" a big "bang" started the evolution of the universe, the big bang was started by a big gun!

Well I haven't made any claims about QM because frankly, I know very little about it. But, if QM can prove (not that it has) that particles can act randomly, then determinism is at risk. Now, of course, proving that they act randomly and not knowing why they are acting how they are are two very different things. However, I would say that QM COULD affect our beliefs on determinism. Not saying it does at this point... but I think that there is a real potential that it could.

Lol, well I was talking more about an actual correlation than an analogy, which is what that is... guns have no actual correlation to the big bang. Not to mention that even if you could draw a correlation, that argument falls victim to the false analogy.

I was just appreciating your understanding that because X and Y have a correlation, it doesn't mean that X causes Y or vice versa.

Particles don't exist: matter exists. Particles are a misnomer carried over from our classical understanding. But, given that, QM doesn't say matter acts non-deterministically. On the contrary, every single thing you do in QM is based around *deterministic* differential equations.

In general, it's kind of impossible to do science (which is in the business of investigating events and postulating causes for those events) when things happen for no reason without cause. And quantum theory is a very, very successful theory.

Even if, however, quantum theory did somehow undermine a strict causal determinism at the most basic levels of physics (again, it doesn't), the whole point of the quantum-classical divide is that physics is pretty different up at the level where things like neurons operate: any quantum effects would have been drowned out through decoherence long, long below the temperature at which a brain operates. So it's fundamentally impossible for QM to have any relevance at all to this issue, even granting a completely materialist understanding of consciousness, free-will and determinism.

It's just one great big giant category mistake.

Other than, in our sample of one universe, presence of guns predicted a big bang happened every time.

Clearly you know more than me on the subject, but what you are saying, then, is that every theory or idea in QM can be determined or is consistent with determinism?

Sure, that could be true, but doesn't mean that it entails a valid analogy in THIS universe. Would be unrelated, really.

Pretty much. There's no conflict, here. You point to a probability in QM and I'll explain what determines it.

Lol, I can't and won't do that. Really, you could be tossing a bunch of BS at me and I wouldn't know the difference. QM is far beyond my scope. I like to analyze determinism more in terms of logical possibility than QM. I am not saying that the bit I have looked into isn't interesting. I am just saying that I don't yet (and may never) understand it enough to appeal to it in arguments.

On a different note, I do want to ask a question about a bit I did read on it. Do anti-particles help explain the 11 (or at least 4+) dimensions?

Well, I don't know jack-squat about string theory, but anti-particles are already understood pretty well in a regular QFT framework. I can't imagine how their existence would support theories with more than 4 dimensions. But don't quote me on that, I really just don't know.

Well, I remember reading (I think) that they seemingly come in and out of existence, and that the explanation to that is that they are traveling through the different dimensions.

That sounds like gibberish to me :3

lol, might be. Like I said, I don't hold many beliefs when it comes to this. Just thought I would toss it out there since you seem to at least understand it to some degree. But yea, pretty sure I read that somewhere.

Not like H. J. Morowitz is a quantum physicist, but he does provide an essay on the subject of quantum physics and free will. Seems like he might be pretty much wrong, but it still might be worth a read.

Also, I should stop joking around! Big bangs and guns are not areas of expertise for me!