Affirmative Action

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Affirmative Action
 Ramuh.Haseyo
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By Ramuh.Haseyo 2010-10-09 20:31:35
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Cerberus.Nequito said:
African American is actually incorrect unless you were orignially born in Africa and now live in America. Otherwise you are American of African decent. That is if you are not like me and dont wanna call myself American of European decent evey time i fill out paperwork.

"African Americans (also referred to as Black Americans or Afro-Americans, and formerly as American Negroes) are citizens or residents of the United States who have origins in any of the black populations of Africa. In the United States, the terms are generally used for Americans with at least partial Sub-Saharan African ancestry."

If you were born in Africa, you are African.
I know the wording is strange, but that's how it works.
 Cerberus.Nequito
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By Cerberus.Nequito 2010-10-09 20:35:29
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Ramuh.Haseyo said:
Cerberus.Nequito said:
African American is actually incorrect unless you were orignially born in Africa and now live in America. Otherwise you are American of African decent. That is if you are not like me and dont wanna call myself American of European decent evey time i fill out paperwork.
"African Americans (also referred to as Black Americans or Afro-Americans, and formerly as American Negroes) are citizens or residents of the United States who have origins in any of the black populations of Africa. In the United States, the terms are generally used for Americans with at least partial Sub-Saharan African ancestry." If you were born in Africa, you are African. I know the wording is strange, but that's how it works.

Iwent through 2 weeks of Equal Opportunity schooling for the Army and this was the hottest topic.
Bottom line.... If you were not born in Africa you are not African American you are however, American Of African decent PERIOD.
 Ramuh.Haseyo
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By Ramuh.Haseyo 2010-10-09 20:40:38
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I really don't care, but that's how us blackies call each other. I just say black, just like I call any form of an European white. Want to specify? Sure, whatever.
 Cerberus.Nequito
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By Cerberus.Nequito 2010-10-09 20:42:29
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I can respect that Haseyo.

One more thing , Suck my *** Excelior
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 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 20:44:51
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Cerberus.Nequito said:
I can respect that Haseyo. One more thing , Suck my *** Excelior

what the *** did i do?
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2010-10-09 20:53:11
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Phoenix.Excelior said:

(I wrote this in a hurry, *** you if i made a grammer or spelling error)

lol, I wouldn't have been a grammar Nazi if I didn't think that your initial post(the speech) wasn't going to be turned in. You mentioned "your college" and "speech" so I assumed this was for some public speaking class, so just giving you a heads up on any errors I saw before you got points docked from the teacher.
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 Leviathan.Hastefeet
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By Leviathan.Hastefeet 2010-10-09 20:56:16
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Phoenix.Excelior said:
Cerberus.Nequito said:
I can respect that Haseyo. One more thing , Suck my *** Excelior

what the *** did i do?

EVERYTHING
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 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 21:09:58
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Leviathan.Hastefeet said:
Phoenix.Excelior said:
Cerberus.Nequito said:
I can respect that Haseyo. One more thing , Suck my *** Excelior
what the *** did i do?
EVERYTHING

Oh yea, I'm white. *** me.
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 Caitsith.Zefiris
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By Caitsith.Zefiris 2010-10-09 21:15:02
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I actually have a lot of sympathy towards white males. They're constantly blamed for everything wrong with a societal model they didn't personally create, and they're put into a position where they can't complain about any injustice without receiving tons of backlash.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra
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By Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra 2010-10-09 21:19:37
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Yeah seriously.

My roommate has a lower GPA, less HS activity and service, a worse entrance essay, and a much worse interview than I did for our college.

Guess which one got more scholarships; the Indian, or the Cracker?

-_- Thank God I love him.
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 Leviathan.Hastefeet
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By Leviathan.Hastefeet 2010-10-09 21:22:22
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Caitsith.Zefiris said:
I actually have a lot of sympathy towards white males. They're constantly blamed for everything wrong with a societal model they didn't personally create, and they're put into a position where they can't complain about any injustice without receiving tons of backlash.

yeah being blamed for slavery when you're polish and your parents are from Poland doesn't make any sense, i had NOTHING to do with it
 Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra
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By Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra 2010-10-09 21:25:34
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Yeah, I got yelled at in the locker room last year for "HOLDIN MAH PEOPLE DOWN IN SLAVERY".

I'm not even third generation here.
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 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 21:30:13
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Leviathan.Hastefeet said:
Caitsith.Zefiris said:
I actually have a lot of sympathy towards white males. They're constantly blamed for everything wrong with a societal model they didn't personally create, and they're put into a position where they can't complain about any injustice without receiving tons of backlash.
yeah being blamed for slavery when you're polish and your parents are from Poland doesn't make any sense, i had NOTHING to do with it

If you listen to what Tim Wise says he says something to this effect:
"It is white people's responsibility to fix disadvantaged people, every job a white man has is a job that could have gone to a minority"

Basically he's saying that race is a Zero-Sum equation and that all the benefits a white man has must come from the cost of another race.
 Caitsith.Zefiris
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By Caitsith.Zefiris 2010-10-09 21:32:55
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Well even still, we use products and services that are offered to us by people earning low, or possibly no wages. Are we not all responsible for some form of slavery then?
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 Bahamut.Dasva
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By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 21:34:28
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Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Well even still, we use products and services that are offered to us by people earning low, or possibly no wages. Are we not all responsible for some form of slavery then?
Nope. I completely isolate myself. That's like the propaganda they used to throw out about how if you do drugs you support terrorism lol
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 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 21:35:41
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Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Well even still, we use products and services that are offered to us by people earning low, or possibly no wages. Are we not all responsible for some form of slavery then?

He would think so I guess. I've watched about 6 hours worth of his videos on youtube trying to figure out what the *** this guy's problem is, then I found one where he admited it with this quote:

"I understand that this conversation is going to piss white people off, I know republicans and conversatives will be mad too. Radica Liberals like us are here to discuss this conversation and we know what they think doesn't matter":
 Caitsith.Zefiris
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By Caitsith.Zefiris 2010-10-09 21:38:27
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Oh I wasn't referring to the guy you were talking about, just asking questions. :3 Trying to dissect the blame game people play. >.<
 Leviathan.Hastefeet
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By Leviathan.Hastefeet 2010-10-09 21:45:21
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Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Well even still, we use products and services that are offered to us by people earning low, or possibly no wages. Are we not all responsible for some form of slavery then?

i live in the mountains and i made my computer and internet source and even my copys of ffxi and ffxiv out of things lying around out there

i didnt use anyone so HA
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 Bismarck.Tgibs
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By Bismarck.Tgibs 2010-10-09 21:48:20
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Affirmative action is to the relatively poor and powerless as Nepotism is to the relatively wealthy and powerful.

so my take is affirmative action simply tries to counteract nepotism. Of course i do realize that this may sound good on paper and that which is sound on paper rarely works out perfectly in real life.

(defenition of nepotism: favoritism shown by somebody in power to relatives and friends, especially in appointing them to good positions)
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 Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra
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By Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra 2010-10-09 21:51:06
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Bismarck.Tgibs said:
Affirmative action is to the relatively poor and powerless as Nepotism is to the relatively wealthy and powerful.

so my take is affirmative action simply tries to counteract nepotism. Of course i do realize that this may sound good on paper and that which is sound on paper rarely works out perfectly in real life.

(defenition of nepotism: favoritism shown by somebody in power to relatives and friends, especially in appointing them to good positions)

So capitalistic elitism?
 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 21:51:08
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As much as I like the idea of telling people to suck it up I am concerned about one question:

At what point do we as a society need to pick others up so that we can grow stronger to achieve that next level of society?

The obvious solution is a dramatic overhaul on the education system K-12 and college. We need to find a way to send almost everyone to some form of college or technical school. Once we increase our population's skills we'd create more jobs, we'd have a better quality of living, and we'd definately be more healthy.
 Bahamut.Dasva
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By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 21:51:18
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Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Oh I wasn't referring to the guy you were talking about, just asking questions. :3 Trying to dissect the blame game people play. >.<
I wasn't either. I don't like the guilt by far off association. I use plastic the making of which has bad chemicals blah blah, 7 degrees of kevin bacon and bam I killed some kid with cancer
 Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra
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By Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra 2010-10-09 21:52:17
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Phoenix.Excelior said:
As much as I like the idea of telling people to suck it up I am concerned about one question:

At what point do we as a society need to pick others up so that we can grow stronger to achieve that next level of society?

The obvious solution is a dramatic overhaul on the education system K-12 and college. We need to find a way to send almost everyone to some form of college or technical school. Once we increase our population's skills we'd create more jobs, we'd have a better quality of living, and we'd definately be more healthy.

Paper communism into laissez faire capitalism.

 Caitsith.Zefiris
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By Caitsith.Zefiris 2010-10-09 21:56:18
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Bismarck.Tgibs said:
Affirmative action is to the relatively poor and powerless as Nepotism is to the relatively wealthy and powerful.

so my take is affirmative action simply tries to counteract nepotism. Of course i do realize that this may sound good on paper and that which is sound on paper rarely works out perfectly in real life.

(defenition of nepotism: favoritism shown by somebody in power to relatives and friends, especially in appointing them to good positions)
Which is why people should be evaluated based on their particular skills and whether they're right for whatever position you're looking advertising. Nobody should be hired because they're your friend or because their skin color fills a mandated quota. I guess I'm just saying, both exist and both suck. But that's life. >.<
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 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 21:57:04
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Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra said:
Phoenix.Excelior said:
As much as I like the idea of telling people to suck it up I am concerned about one question: At what point do we as a society need to pick others up so that we can grow stronger to achieve that next level of society? The obvious solution is a dramatic overhaul on the education system K-12 and college. We need to find a way to send almost everyone to some form of college or technical school. Once we increase our population's skills we'd create more jobs, we'd have a better quality of living, and we'd definately be more healthy.
Paper communism into laissez faire capitalism.

I don't mean that. After a certain quality of living societys are able to devote more time and resources to fixing higher problems. If we didn't have to worry about crime, hunger, education etc, we could devote more time to sciences. The next level of society is theory is the "biotech era". Basically its an era of rapid medical advancements that enhance or increase life and aspects of it in general. We're right now closing the "Industrial era" but we're not quite ready for the next step. I think a big reason is that we have a lot of domestic and international concerns on the table so we arent able to focus on this ***.
 Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra
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By Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra 2010-10-09 22:00:40
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Phoenix.Excelior said:
Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra said:
Phoenix.Excelior said:
As much as I like the idea of telling people to suck it up I am concerned about one question: At what point do we as a society need to pick others up so that we can grow stronger to achieve that next level of society? The obvious solution is a dramatic overhaul on the education system K-12 and college. We need to find a way to send almost everyone to some form of college or technical school. Once we increase our population's skills we'd create more jobs, we'd have a better quality of living, and we'd definately be more healthy.
Paper communism into laissez faire capitalism.

I don't mean that. After a certain quality of living societys are able to devote more time and resources to fixing higher problems. If we didn't have to worry about crime, hunger, education etc, we could devote more time to sciences. The next level of society is theory is the "biotech era". Basically its an era of rapid medical advancements that enhance or increase life and aspects of it in general. We're right now closing the "Industrial era" but we're not quite ready for the next step. I think a big reason is that we have a lot of domestic and international concerns on the table so we arent able to focus on this ***.

Oh, I just meant "That seems like the most logical way to implement."
 Caitsith.Zefiris
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By Caitsith.Zefiris 2010-10-09 22:02:59
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Bahamut.Dasva said:
Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Oh I wasn't referring to the guy you were talking about, just asking questions. :3 Trying to dissect the blame game people play. >.<
I wasn't either. I don't like the guilt by far off association. I use plastic the making of which has bad chemicals blah blah, 7 degrees of kevin bacon and bam I killed some kid with cancer
Well, it's kind of why I'm asking how come people get blamed for an institution they didn't create? Even if their parents were the worst form of slave owner, why should they be defined by what their parents did?

And so, I was wondering why people are being blamed for a slavery that ended over a century ago but we all still support a slavery that exists at the present?
 Phoenix.Excelior
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By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 22:03:10
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Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra said:
Phoenix.Excelior said:
Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra said:
Phoenix.Excelior said:
As much as I like the idea of telling people to suck it up I am concerned about one question: At what point do we as a society need to pick others up so that we can grow stronger to achieve that next level of society? The obvious solution is a dramatic overhaul on the education system K-12 and college. We need to find a way to send almost everyone to some form of college or technical school. Once we increase our population's skills we'd create more jobs, we'd have a better quality of living, and we'd definately be more healthy.
Paper communism into laissez faire capitalism.
I don't mean that. After a certain quality of living societys are able to devote more time and resources to fixing higher problems. If we didn't have to worry about crime, hunger, education etc, we could devote more time to sciences. The next level of society is theory is the "biotech era". Basically its an era of rapid medical advancements that enhance or increase life and aspects of it in general. We're right now closing the "Industrial era" but we're not quite ready for the next step. I think a big reason is that we have a lot of domestic and international concerns on the table so we arent able to focus on this ***.
Oh, I just meant "That seems like the most logical way to implement."

Oh, I'm not sure I agree completely. For economic purposes Laize Faire is definately the best choice for capitialism. However, we need to push our capitalism in the right direction. For example we really need to make a move on alternative energy for national security and energy sources for the future. We also need to encourage and create new industrys in the science, and we're definately not doing that now. I think if we provided more funds to R&D companies we'd be doing the right thing.
 Odin.Gosuapple
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By Odin.Gosuapple 2010-10-09 22:05:15
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Phoenix.Excelior said:
I'm giving a speech to the President's Advisory Council of my college to end affirmative action in my school. This is my speech, tell me what you think and if you find disagreements. I'm curious what opinion is.

Insofar as you appear to be sincere in trying to better your speech, I will critique your paper without regard to my personal opinion on affirmative action.

First and foremost, ANY speech or paper on affirmative action SHOULD address the supreme court ruling on the matter. Second, your viewpoint will alienate a portion of those you are trying to persuade in and of itself, you shouldn't bring up unnecessarily divisive issues such as your personal political feelings; i.e., Bush is dumb, Obama is this or that etc. Adding these things will only dilute your point.
Further, in the beginning you refer to what the founding fathers thought. If any of your audience has a background in political science you will immediately lose their esteem. It is widely accepted in the academic community that the founding fathers were a group distinct and divided enough that it makes no sense to say they thought this or they thought that because as a rule there were founding fathers on both sides of any issue.
Lastly your tone is far to informal; you should not be using words like pissed or contractions in something like this. Also your grammar needs serious work.

Oh and this is a bit of an after thought, but lumping all the pro-affirmative action people together and saying they believe something is argumentative fallacy. It's both ad hominem and a sweeping generalization. Attack the principle not the people or you will lose credibility.
 Bahamut.Dasva
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By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 22:09:04
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Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Bahamut.Dasva said:
Caitsith.Zefiris said:
Oh I wasn't referring to the guy you were talking about, just asking questions. :3 Trying to dissect the blame game people play. >.<
I wasn't either. I don't like the guilt by far off association. I use plastic the making of which has bad chemicals blah blah, 7 degrees of kevin bacon and bam I killed some kid with cancer
Well, it's kind of why I'm asking how come people get blamed for an institution they didn't create? Even if their parents were the worst form of slave owner, why should they be defined by what their parents did?

And so, I was wondering why people are being blamed for a slavery that ended over a century ago but we all still support a slavery that exists at the present?
Cause people like to lord over others and take anything for free they can get.

I seriously we are giving benefits to people that have never suffered what we are giving them stuff for nor any of there living relatives and yet they feel entitled to it? Because those of us who had nothing to do with it but our grand grand grand papa did?

Where is it going to stop? Most of europe conquered most the know world at once!!! Make them pay!!! This country stole part of another country and murdered the citizen so many centuries ago!!!

What I don't get is how native americans go on how we stole there land but put them in camps so long ago and how they should get special treatment for it but what happens when japanese talk about it how they were put into camps and had there property and stuff taken from them only like 60-70 years ago? What special treatment and money etc do they and there kids get?