Group 2 Merits (monk)

You saying that you not farm and trying to trigger !! and if you do you always have 2nd mnk there with you?

I trigger farm on war

Yeah but OP asking whats best merit for g2 and answering go WAR instead is not an answer. Its about whats more useful to have on mnk now that you can use on main events now and penance is useful and for sure worth to have 5/5 over lol 80 hp regen.

What's your point exactly? Both Penance and Invigorate are clearly more useful than the other options (Mantra/Formless), which you put the last merit in will in no way make or break you.

No, I said it's situational, based on what exactly you do as mnk. Not everyone goes trigger farming on mnk. I do abyssea on mnk, sure, just not trigger farming (and not everyone here may, either). You're saying penance 5/5 is better in every situation and I'm saying it's going to be situational.

Let's say penance wins in 6 situations and Invig wins in 3

That's still situational.

What you're saying is penance wins in 9 situations, invig wins in 0, which isn't the case.

So let's say penance wins more times than invig does, if you're in the situations where invig wins more than you are the ones where penance wins, then why do invig?

again, it's situational

thats becouse something is marginal it doesnt mean one isnt better then the other and 20 sec more penance is clearly better then 80 HP regen from time to time. If you have a problem with me pointing out so marginal improvement in game where ppl pay 1000% more for item with 1 STR more or when im arguing with someone who care to make his chakra heal 20HP more by getting HQ items I should rather ask whats your point exactly?

Except it's not always better. I don't see what part of that you aren't getting.

Ok If some bLM will ask you whats better to merit lightning potency or wind potency you will say its situacional because you can meet some lightning resistance mob and wind dmg will be more useful there? OR you will say merit lightning because in general its better?

if you only use your blm to fight something that takes more damage from wind-based nukes than thunder-based nukes, then it would be more beneficial to merit wind potency than thunder potency.

Because they're equally marginal in situational circumstances?

Lots of curing / 1 Monk = Penance wins (barely, because 25% of the accumulated enemy TP in 20 seconds must be equivalent to about 20-30tp? assuming average amount of melee). More so due to most melee blinking damage, reducing most of enemy TP gain anyway, it's an upgrade, like +1STR, but like +1STR, it's small.

Edit: Let's not forget Subtle blow builds coming forth

Lack of curing or multiple MNKs = Invigorate. A situation I find myself in quite frequently, where the extra 80hp, where small, might make me live through an extra hit considering most enemies have moves that bypass or wipe shadows.

Both are small but situationally more advantageous than the other, do what works for you, get out with your ignorant ***.

- As a side note, what requires Formless nowadays? I never used it beyond that Limbus zone, so I took it out and went 5 Penance/Invig.

You would be chased out of RDM forums with that attitude.

I'd say if you fought wind if you're in that situation more often than not, and if you're in the situation more often than not that lighting resistance would be better, then use that.

Again, it's based on the individual and what situation that individual is in more often.

Yes, penance is better for !! farming, but guess what, not every person does that on mnk.

Solution custom built for your situation will always > one built for a general situation, period. If you disagree, you're wrong

That being said, if he's in a situation where he'd want to use penance more often, then merit penance. If not then there's no need.

Also other blms in your group having 1 or the other merited has no effect on you. Another mnk having penance will have an effect on you, also to keep in mind.

It's situational, period.

20-30tp in 20 sec is assuming you solo. In situation where you have like 3 ppl melee the mob (like nin+war+mnk) its more like 200-300TP and there is possibility that we will need to throw THFs on things for TH now and it will be even more useful. If regen from Invi make you live through an extra hit you doing it wrong. If really regen helps in the fight you should be getting Regen III or IV or II if not WHM around.

Again, you're ignoring the fact that dual mnks penance. This is a situation someone will be in and one I'm in often when I'm doing events on mnk. There's also soloing.

Look you just said "In situation where"

Now look back at what I said.

It's situational. I don't know what part of that you can't understand.

If you want to be really pro, cap all your job's merits and when you do ls abyssea, you get 10 merits and 9999 limit points anyways. When you feel you'll need penance, drop invig from 5 to 4, dump 5 merits in penance.

When you want to use invig, drop penance down and bring invig up. ***I ran out of stuff to merit before abyssea even came out, lol

the part when you trying to give advice which g2 merits are better and actually ending up saying its situacinal. quess what everything in this game is situacional. Someone else will say he only use mnk on farming elementals and he has 5/5 formless. Its all about whats more useful in common situations.

Again, it's not about common situations.

It's about YOUR situation.

Yes, it's situational, that's why you pick the situation YOU are in most.

If he procs reds more often than not, then yes, penance is for him.

If he's more of a soloist, or has 2 mnks more often than not, lv 5 penance is pretty worthless.

I'm not just saying it's situational.

I'm saying

This situation if you XYZ

This situation if you ABC

If you ABC more than XYZ, go with ABC

If you XYZ more than ABC, go with XYZ.

You'd have a point if I simply said it were situational, and left it at that.

Good thing to compare this to is Bio3 vs other merits on RDM.
It's about YOU, not what everybody else does.

MNKs give around 7tp/hit to a mob prior to Subtle blow. With black belt and Rajas alone (and job trait obviously). This is down to 5tp. Penance makes this 3.75ish/hit.

With haste and 25% haste gear, you're attacking once every 3 seconds. So 3.75tp*2 per round. In 20 seconds with Penance active you feed it 52tp. That's how much it saves you with that one extra merit. With MORE melee it's even more useless, since it's TP gain in 20 second will by far exceed 100. Stop pretending this last merit cures cancer.

As for Regen, right now it's once of the most useless spells around. Like I said, most mobs can bypass or ignore shadows, *** if I want regen being casting on me instead of a cure. It's got nothing to do with saving them MP, it's just a nice little bonus while my mages can focus on doing things that actually help. (Though it may change with Regen IV)

No, Bio III is 100% useless now even for solo.

Not outside aby! :P

Hai guise! Your merits suck! What you think about Monk is wrong! Abyssea this, Abyssea that! Endgame Roar! Solo, man! Depends on ur subtle blow gearset! Look at me I am smart! Doopty do RDM - this is a MNK thread! Is PLD useful? No, yes. You're an idiot. No u. Mantra!!!!!!!!!

Just do what you think looks most useful to the way you like to play. Damn.

This is what I ment >_>

It's not any one person. It's mostly just Monday morning;;