Interesting Thought I Never Dreamed Possible

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Interesting thought I never dreamed possible
 Sylph.Darkside
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By Sylph.Darkside 2010-09-16 15:56:41
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It is possible to have a 4 hit with the Keitonotachi +1 w/ Store Tp
With a 464 delay you need 105 Stp to achieve a 4 Hit Build. Check this out. Yes I know there is no give to gear swap for WS but to think we havent even seen the new end game gear yet or AF3 Hands/Body. Pretty Interesting if you ask me.


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 Quetzalcoatl.Volkom
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By Quetzalcoatl.Volkom 2010-09-16 16:00:04
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inefficient i would think...
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 Sylph.Darkside
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By Sylph.Darkside 2010-09-16 16:18:53
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I'm not saying it's a great set right now but it opens up doors to sets in the future. Especially if Sam gets another stp job trait and not to mention what new "end game" gear will look like. It's exciting to think about.
 Quetzalcoatl.Giazz
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By Quetzalcoatl.Giazz 2010-09-16 17:57:09
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Except there is one problem:

100 storeTP is the max. Therefore, a 4hit build is not possible with a 464 delay. (even FFXIcalculator uses that rule, and won't let you add anymore STP past that point etc.)

The reason is because storeTP works and is calculated as a percent.

Typically any percentile increases will cap at 100%

We know that haste% caps at 80% in this game, but this is obviously because haste is a direct reduction of your weapon's delay. Therefore it has increasing returns the more you add. Adding Haste% is not the same as adding percentages of double attack.

In the case of Double attack, unless SE feels like implementing a lower cap, the maximum cap that it could possibly have is 100%, which would give you a double attack on every hit. Also, in % (percent) increase, double attack has diminishing returns. Adding more DA to your previous DA is less of an increase than adding DA to no DA.

Going back to storeTP: When adding storeTP you are adding percentages.

To add storeTP to your base TP per hit, you are adding a percent of your base TP per hit.

Also base TP per hit is determined by your weapon's delay, based on these formulas:


Example: a 464 delay weapon has a 12.2 base TP per hit. If you add 10 StoreTP, then you are really adding 10% of your weapon's base TP per hit, to your weapon's base TP per hit.

So, it's 12.2 * .10 +(12.2) = 13.4 TP per hit.

Or looking at it this way: 10% of 12.2 TP is: 1.2 TP

Therefore, 12.2 + 1.2 is: 13.4 TP per hit.

When you add 100 storeTP, you are adding "100% of your base TP per hit" to your base TP per hit.

Therefore, you are adding all of your base TP per hit. In other words you are effectively doubling your base TP per hit, increasing it 100%.

100 percent of something means all of something.

That being said, the lowest possible delay needed for a 4hit build is 470 delay, which requires 100STP (100% max) to do it.

Math for the above claim:




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By Odin.Dirtyfinger 2010-09-16 18:02:57
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Will be able to 4hit 480delay weapons such as Polearm and a few GK. If SE give us another tier of STP and a decent 480delay GK then that would be incredible.
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-09-16 18:04:15
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Good God, thread #2
 Quetzalcoatl.Giazz
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By Quetzalcoatl.Giazz 2010-09-16 18:05:01
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Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Good God, thread #2

Yeah... =/
 Ifrit.Eikechi
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By Ifrit.Eikechi 2010-09-16 19:36:05
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not trying to say its possible, or reasonable, but the calculator I used, with full merits and 464 delay says you need 70 STP in gear to 4 hit....so where are you guys getting 100+ from?
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-09-16 20:14:43
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Ifrit.Eikechi said:
not trying to say its possible, or reasonable, but the calculator I used, with full merits and 464 delay says you need 70 STP in gear to 4 hit....so where are you guys getting 100+ from?

Because full merits +70 = 105.
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 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-16 20:22:10
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That is nice logic and all but is there any actual proof that store tp caps at 100?
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-09-16 20:24:40
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I think old calc let you surpass 100, once Rose strap was added, in campaign you could exceed 100STP and then it was updated.
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 Alexander.Vivicide
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By Alexander.Vivicide 2010-09-24 21:46:47
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According to my math you only need +70 stp with 464 delay weapon and you have +73.. unless my eyes went crossed while I was counting (highly possible). There is a little room for improvement with that.

Which at this point if you really feel the need to peruse this you can probably ditch the Unkai Nodawa which after briefly looking back at the gear set seems to be the greatest gain in stats. PCC/J.tork TP then Ire Torque +1 WS is probably the greatest gain in stats for this build.