Alternative 6hit. Is It Feasible?

Can someone explain to me why ppl seems to favor usu feets, and at the same time say haste > all when fuma have 1% more haste than usu?

Same ppl that says usu feet > fuma, also say turban > loldenali because turban has 1% more haste. This desnt make sense to me.

The 7 stp from usu feet put you from 6-hit to 5-hit? you need that 7 acc that bad that its worth sacrificing 1% haste for it?

i think the reason people go turban > denali is because denali you dont gain much for your 1% loss.. on the other hand with usu > fuma for that 1% you get so much more (for example if you can cut a whole swing out of your 100TP build)

when replacing the fuma with usu feet you get enough STP to be able to use dusk gloves on hands over the hatchiman. you're actually gaining +2% haste.

the 6 hit is key. but after you obtain that, the next step in gear upgrade is getting as much haste gear as you can while still maintaining the 6hit build. it can be done without usu feet as well with askar body, but you loose so much acc it's not worth it. 9 out of 10 times, the usu feet are required to replace the hatchiman hands within a 6hit build for the haste boost.

But if you're using rose strap you can have both fuma and dusk. or am I missing something?

you're missing the double attack +2% from a quality strap

only place i've seen that rose strat work properly is on a rng for a STP 5hit build.

so basically 2% DA > 1% haste then?

Forgive me for all questions, but I'll be the first to admit I know nothing about SAM. Just from reading this forum I got the impression that haste > everything. Thats why I figured that fuma + dusk = 1% more haste than usu + dusk, and that that 1% haste > 2% DA.

If you have enough Store TP, you can also have -3% Delay, which is better than Pole grip as well. That's one of the many reasons sacrificing 1% haste is worth it sometimes.

And nothing is ever absolute. Things are situational, and you can never compare one stat to another by saying 2% DA > 1% haste. That's not how this game works.

ok well, that makes sense I guess. since delay -3% and haste kinda wokrs the same way when it comes to melee (I assume atleast), meaning you're hitting faster, getting TP faster and WS more. Right?

That would be exactly it ^_^ DoT.

you seem to be out of arguments very fast. as a poster above said you can't say turban > ace's and usu feet > fumas at the same time. haste > everything indeed. And since sam can have store tp on the body, usu feet are useless for great katanas. QED

As far are strap are concerned, 1% haste is always better than 2% da unless you are solo or something ( low haste situations), so rose strap + fumas is always better than pole grip + usu feet. Next, if you own both feet and body of usukane you can use sword strap. sword strap gives you the exact same delay reduction as 1% haste, which means that pole grip + fumas+ usubody is always better than sword strap + usu feet + usu body for caped accuracy. If you dont completely suck you cap accuracy on sam on anything because sushi exist.

this reminds me that you showed a set on the first page saying "this or gtfo". please remove cuchulain's mantle from that set, because its bad for GK ( same reason: sushi exist), only good for PA.


Now, usu feet are still the best for 480 delay polearms, rindomarus, pachipachio.

To make you rage even more, and I know the little nerd inside you will, if you have neither usu feet, usu body nor rose strap, the next best set up is sushi + hachiman body ( or askar+ ecphoria ring i guess)+full haste.

And since you make a racist comment at the end of your post, I can make one here that perfectly suits the situaton:

NA, doing it wrong since 2005.

IS IT FEASYBALL CAN YOU DO IT?!

GKT SAM doesn't need to use Sushi. Ever. It's called Marinara Pizza, and if YOU don't completely suck, you can cap accuracy on anything utilizing a proper store TP set along with Sword Strap.

You make it seem like Pole grip is much more than a 1% increase, but it's not. Haste is exponential, and I'll agree that there are times that Fuma Sune-ate are superior, but you make it sound like they are always, which is not true.

Again, Mr. Frenchy, stop putting the wrong ***in the OP's mind. Usukane feet are better more often than they're not.


Oh, and I never run out of arguments. I just can't stand French players, because for every 10 of them, 1 is mediocre while the rest of them TP in ***like Maat's cap. Tell me I'm wrong.

Though I agree with a lot of what you're saying, when you're talking a permanent DA stat it is giving you TP damage + WS frequency + WS damage, whereas Haste is only giving you the first two. Not a HUGE difference but worth taking into account.

hmm, well if you are indeed at acc cap removing the usu feet and sword strap and putting in pole + fumas should be better. By what i calc'd you need around 29% haste so pole+fumas gets better. You get that as easy as a single march.

Didn't like that sushi argument though...and also the one about sword strap giving the exact same delay reduction of 1% haste. It actually gives the exact delay reduction of 3% haste if you were naked. -delay also has exponential gains, we just cant stack them like we can with haste.

EDIT: Raen although DA increases the ws epeeness, haste/-delay increases it's frequency, which reflects the total ws damage one can shear.

How would you calculate DA's effect on WS damage vs. WS frequency? I'm not sure you would. If we wanted to see how DA effected WS we'd just take the delta of double attack x .70 right?

yup i used to use
pole grip + hachi hands for 17% haste/6 hit

now ive upgraded to
rose strap + dusk gloves for 20% haste/6 hit

would love to do salvage just for some usu feet

DA increases the frequency too! DA'd attacks give you TP. DA on things like Brutal Earring for comparison purposes don't give you WS damage because you can swap them out, but you cannot with a grip so it is important to include the fact that it includes WS damage alongside frequency, whereas Haste/-delay only provides the latter.

Sushi can win if your accuracy is hideous beforehand (maybe a few mobs you want to GKT vs Polearm). Obviously Pizza is the food of choice for most situations though.

It's complex. Depends on (in SAM's case) whether the DA'd hit benefits from the accuracy/attack bonus of the WS itself, the chance of it activating compared to usual, etc etc.

so looking back at my op...

that set is not worth it what-so-ever, correct?

Not by a long shot :p

Thanks, that was the answer I've been trying to get since last night. lol

Usu Body/Usu Feet/Sword Strap > Usu Body/Fuma/Pole Grip

I can see only one situation where the fuma build would win, and that's in an extremely high haste zerg. If you're /WAR that is. Too bad /DRG would handilly win in a proper zerg (and anywhere else you'd use GKT at) and makes capping Haste possible without Fuma.

Wrong.

Usu body, fuma, pole grip wins when acc is capped and have double march hasso and haste.

Wyvern Earring.

/DRG > /WAR unless you're using polearm.

In a Sam zerg aren't you doing WS a lot more often than you are meleeing? So wouldn't /war be better for higher WS than /drg that does next to nothing for your WS dmg?

I bring pole and gkt w/ me wherever I go, if it's something like Ejar ect, where the mobs are unpredictable, then I go /war just in case, then once the mobs come up I decide between gkt and polearm.

10% DA isn't going to proc enough to make a difference, Berserk does nothing for Gekko.

However, /DRG let's you cap haste and use sword strap, which will give you the highest WS frequency you can get.

Again, note where I said I bring /war to things like Einherjar where I do not know which I will be using until the mobs pop. The only time I sub drg is when I go in, specifically expecting to use gkt. And depending on your haste gear, you won't even benefit fully from the earring to begin with.

If you have a perfect haste set up, you only gain 2% haste from earring, at which point, I'd doubt it being able to stand up to 10% DA.

Really? Because with the amount of haste you seem to have regularly, that 2% is getting you an 8% improvement easily. Toss on the guaranteed 3% from Sword Strap and we've got a winner.

W/ a dnc, sure, 2% haste go.
w/o a dnc, you're not getting 8% increase from 2% haste.

2/30 = 6.67% increase.

Even compounding it w/ sword strap is 1.0667 x 1.03 = 9.87% increase to dot/ws dmg.

5 da vs 17 da
117/105 = 11.4% increase to dot/ws frequency and also adds to direct ws dmg.

Then you have jumps, which the value is lowered w/ the higher amount of haste you have and zerk, which while you'll never get the full benefit, can still add some damage to higher end mobs.

Question, what's your definition of Optimal Build? The build I use has generally higher stats, because you can forgo quite a few haste bits because Wyvern earrign makes up for them and you can subsitute in other stats such as acc str and att.