SAM Polearm Gear Advice

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SAM polearm gear advice
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2009-10-29 19:32:11
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Mogue: Going from a 6-hit build to a 5-hit build improves the WS portion of your DPS by 25%. The math is there, and unfortunately 5-hit SAM/WAR polearm meat builds do win over DRG/SAM in a meripo.

Also, chill the *** out because Ghaleon's right. ACC buff in a bird meripo is a waste of a buff, nobody should be needing it. Double March, tack on double Minuet if you've got a second BRD. Madrigal is your cue to /pcmd leave. It shouldn't just be a waste for a DRG, it should be a waste for every meleeing member of your party.
 Phoenix.Mogue
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By Phoenix.Mogue 2009-10-29 19:41:39
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Nightfyre said:
ACC buff in a bird meripo is a waste of a buff


Which is exactly what i said in both my first and second post.
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2009-10-29 19:47:06
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Phoenix.Mogue said:
you'd have to be giving both an accuracy buff like hunter's (wasted on properly geared / merited drg)

You said nothing about any job except DRG and implied the SAM requires an ACC buff, which is not the case.

You also mentioned Zahak's v Aurum for Drakesbane; to my knowledge it was never conclusively demonstrated either way and may well vary by your dDEX and pDIF.
 Hades.Hiryo
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By Hades.Hiryo 2009-10-29 19:49:38
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So if my maths is right, with my merits, and if i use Engetsuto, Shinimusha haidate, Hachiman hands and feet and chiv chain, that'll be a 5 hit build right..
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-10-29 20:02:52
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"I'll stipulate that the 92% acc figure with 5/5 usu and Tathlum (and fulltime hasso) might be accurate since I don't feel like crunching the numbers myself, but I still have a hard time believing such a setup will outdo a best-possible-geared DRG (less stage4/5 relic) for any other reason than due to a difference in player skill or subpar macro utilization. The math just isn't there for it.

Also, I think it was reasonably well settled that Zahak's > Aurum always for Drakesbane and Forager's > Cuch provided you keep capped acc. Askar pants are also a reaonably easy upgrade to get over p.pants. :P"

There's still debates on zhak vs aurum. I have 0 interest in Askar pants. I'm 2/3 on ares, only needing the 25. I'll hold out.

As far as relic drg goes, maybe not, but if we want to bring relics into this, sam/war w/ relic bow will kill drg. I'm mainly talking about non relic dmg here.
 Fairy.Ghaleon
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By Fairy.Ghaleon 2009-10-30 14:50:49
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pretty sure you've forgotten about overwhelm for sam, not to mention whats already been said about sam getting a 5hit for polearm, 25% increase in ws's with a 19% increase in ws dmg.
 Hades.Hiryo
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By Hades.Hiryo 2009-10-30 14:55:26
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Incase anyone cares, this is my 5 hit build..

Engetsuto
Pole grip
Walahra Turban
Chiv Chain
Fowling earring
Minuet earring
Woodsmans x2
Hachiman Kote
Hauby
Amemet +1
Life belt
Shini Haidate
Hachiman Sune-ate.


I was hitting 1750 Penta Thrusts wearing this, over 100% tp in 5 hits, 4 with Samurai roll.

I have 5/5 Store TP Merits and 4/5 Overwhelm, and was eating Crab Sushi.
What can i improve in this to put out bigger numbers?
 Fairy.Ghaleon
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By Fairy.Ghaleon 2009-10-30 15:16:58
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Asshat.Mogue said:
Who the *** are you? Need some help with basic reading? Did you see where I specifically referenced wasted accuracy buffs? Do some 2nd grade comprehension before letting loose with the diarrhea of the mouth.



Asshat.Mogue said:
you'd have to be giving both an accuracy buff like hunter's
(You'd = you WOULD - just a little 2nd grade comprehension for you.

Asshat.Mogue said:
sam isn't going to beat any kind of properly geared / merited drg eating meat.


I was merely correcting you, kind sir.
 Shiva.Enjoylife
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By Shiva.Enjoylife 2009-10-30 15:48:21
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if you leave a bardx2 merit pt because u get an accuracy buff you dont deserve the pt
 Fairy.Ghaleon
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By Fairy.Ghaleon 2009-10-30 15:49:15
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Shiva.Enjoylife said:
if you leave a bardx2 merit pt because u get an accuracy buff you dont deserve the pt

You shouldn't have a bard that HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE. Any party with even halfway worthwhile DDs will not require an acc song/roll.
necroskull Necro Bump Detected! [33 days between previous and next post]
 Remora.Laphine
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By Remora.Laphine 2009-12-02 11:57:40
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Fairy.Vegetto said:
Phoenix.Mogue said:
Fairy.Vegetto said:
Sam can beat drg on birds though, lol (and I have both lol)

can =/= should

you'd have to be giving both an accuracy buff like hunter's (wasted on properly geared / merited drg) otherwise the sam is eating sushi and a sushi eating polearm sam isn't going to beat any kind of properly geared / merited drg eating meat.

edit: nice tp gear!
My sam and my drg both pretty much have capped acc w/ meat, no madrigal, no hunter's roll on birds. I have both jobs and while my sam is just a smidge better geared, only missing 2 things I want for drg in terms of ws gear, and from playing both, heca hat and ares legs on ws over what I currently have won't close the current gap between my sam and my drg. (Plus I have gone off against drgs with the gear I am missing and have beaten them as sam)

Don't mind the necrobump please~

This issue popped in my mind today and i remembered this discussion over here. So i figured i would ask here how is it possible lol.

Anyway considering your set Vegetto and 8 pole merits you got:
+250 acc from skill
+60 acc from equip
+47 acc from dex
+10 acc from hasso
= 367
Am i missing something? Cause thats like 75% acc on lv82 colibri. A crab sushi can fit that gap perfectly, but how is it that you maintain ~92% acc with meat? lol

edit: hahaha, i got used to calc acc with one handed jobs. Acc from dex is actually 50% higher. So that +70 acc right there. Still, it would make it a ~85% hit rate. I know i know, plenty to eat meat, but yet not so crazy close to cap.
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-02 12:04:33
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2handers get .75 acc/dex not .5, like one handers. Only thing I can see off hand you're doing wrong. Idk if the rest is correct but that's just what caught my eye.
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-02 12:06:01
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Also, you didn't count acc from my torque. 263 skill, 256 acc there.
 Remora.Laphine
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By Remora.Laphine 2009-12-02 12:08:16
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Ah that closes the gap then.
Bringing it to 90% on lv82, which could mean an avarage of 92 indeed.

Nice stuff is nice.

Never pted with a full usukane thats for sure. It's not so laughable at all. But! No usukane = sushi! I really don't like when i get madrigal on drg <.< but most (no, actually, every single) pole sams i've pted realy failed to eat the right food, when they eat food at all >.>
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-02 12:09:38
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256 (skill)
70 from dex
60 from gear
10 from hasso


396. Acc cap is 405 on lv 82 birds.

2 acc is 1% hitrate, 9 acc under cap = 90.5% hitrate. Higher on lv 81 birds, usually averages me 91-93% on a parse.
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-02 12:33:34
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Easy fix for that problem. It's called /pcmd leave
 Fenrir.Krazyrs
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By Fenrir.Krazyrs 2009-12-02 13:15:08
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i use
Engetsuto|Rose|X|Tiphia
Askar|C.Chain|Fowling|Brutal
Hauby|Hachiman|Blood|Rajas
Foragers|Swift|BH|Fuma

256 skill
75+29 DEX
30 ACC
= 404.8 total acc
with crab sushi have a 94.9% hit rate

Polearm is 8/8 for SAM + DRG
5 JoL's next sea rotation, hopefully can get a Love Torque

we always use BRD + COR for March/March/Chaos/Fighters
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-02 13:42:19
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Fighter's roll will never give the same average exp/hr as corsair's roll, but I guess it's fun to see the larger ws numbers more frequently.
 Fairy.Vegetto
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By Fairy.Vegetto 2009-12-02 13:43:26
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Also w/ acc that high, Turban would serve better than askar, but they should be close enough if you don't feel like carrying turban around.
 Fairy.Juth
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By Fairy.Juth 2009-12-04 19:48:47
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sam with full usukane and use tomoe, /war
me /war, use fay lancer with dmg+4 str+2 dex +3. tp use askar head/body,ares legs,homan hand/feet.
ws use heca head/feet, ares body/legs, alky hand.
the end!
 Pandemonium.Ironguy
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By Pandemonium.Ironguy 2009-12-04 20:09:14
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Fairy.Juth said:
FULL USUKANE IS MAD GOOD

Full Usukane =/= Good player. It's not even the best for Samurai in the first place.

Besides, you just barely outperformed them and I'm sure that Samurai was trash anyways, let alone that parse being rather miniscule sample-wise total; I hope you feel proud.
 Fairy.Juth
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By Fairy.Juth 2009-12-04 20:21:38
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Pandemonium.Ironguy said:
Fairy.Juth said:
FULL USUKANE IS MAD GOOD

Full Usukane =/= Good player. It's not even the best for Samurai in the first place.

Besides, you just barely outperformed them and I'm sure that Samurai was trash anyways, let alone that parse being rather miniscule number-wise total; I hope you feel proud.

dont make up my word, i have never said full usukane = mad good
the main reason i show this example is saying that good gear sam can out dmg drg on ws, but drg's melee dmg can out dmg sam, so they dmg pretty clost.
so stop saying which one is better than other.
btw this sam is not trash.

ps. how come i cant post image.
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2009-12-04 20:22:42
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Because your tags are wrong. [img ][/img ] without the spaces, just like it says below the post box.
 Fairy.Juth
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By Fairy.Juth 2009-12-04 20:26:31
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thank you so much, i am a noob ><
 Pandemonium.Ironguy
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By Pandemonium.Ironguy 2009-12-04 20:29:04
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Fairy.Juth said:
dont make up my word, i have never said full usukane = mad good
the main reason i show this example is saying that good gear sam can out dmg drg on ws, but drg's melee dmg can out dmg sam, so they dmg pretty clost.
so stop saying which one is better than other.
btw this sam is not trash.

ps. how come i cant post image.

A Samurai that knows what he's doing and is merited/geared correctly will never lose to a Dragoon [of equal skill/gear] on Greater Colibri, no matter what; people see the 240 combat skill and think it means our ability with the weapon is terrible, when in reality it's nothing Marinara Pizza +1 can't fix (or in this case for birds, crab sushi if your Samurai isn't exactly "perfect" to where you could eat meat instead).

It's true that Dragoon has a higher DPS and that you also have to include the wyvern as well with a DRG's damage total, but regardless, as long as you're WS'ing the moment you're at 100% TP (bar when the bird's at 7%~ HP) like a correct melee should, the percentage spread between melee and WS damage should never change between people; only the jobs change that (GA: WAR/NIN vs WAR/SAM example, as much as Warrior shouldn't ever have to /NIN in Einherjar/Dynamis/etc).

And to display an image on a forum, type it like this (but without the stars by IMG): [*IMG*]http://urlhere.com/etc[/*IMG*]