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Brd is still Living in 75era.
By Armyguy 2015-09-05 09:05:57
Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2015-09-05 12:01:26
BRD still super important because they way to useful. They can hit both melee's and mages with march and still chose between acc, atk or some mixture thereof. A GEO having to use haste is a really big waste of their more potent unresistable debuffs, and sometimes it's not even an option cause you need Vex / Attunement to prevent the deathga spam of NMs.
That being said, I'd like to see BRD's have more offensive power. Fencer II lets em put out some pretty nice Rudra's if they don't have to spend a ton of time singing. So maybe reduce the cast times on AoE songs from 8s to 4s to help em with that.
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By Damane 2015-09-06 18:00:53
i think the only thign bard needs is some better mage buffs, ballad isnt gonna cut it, some form of mab buff.
thats it
BRD is in a good state. as a buffer COR is the one that needs the most help.
BRD: most flexible buffer > least buff potency
COR: somewhat flesible > more potent potency
GEO: no flexibilty at all > most potent buffs/debuffs.
all buffers have their pros and cons, just because geo is so good now doesnt mean it allways will be. in an environment like nyzul isle for example geo would suck balls compared to BRD when you have to split up pts and move around lol.
cor is the only buffer that gets really *** over in a dispelga heavy fight, its not bard.
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By Asura.Failaras 2015-09-06 19:39:54
i think the only thign bard needs is some better mage buffs, ballad isnt gonna cut it, some form of mab buff.
thats it
BRD is in a good state. as a buffer COR is the one that needs the most help.
BRD: most flexible buffer > least buff potency
COR: somewhat flesible > more potent potency
GEO: no flexibilty at all > most potent buffs/debuffs.
all buffers have their pros and cons, just because geo is so good now doesnt mean it allways will be. in an environment like nyzul isle for example geo would suck balls compared to BRD when you have to split up pts and move around lol.
cor is the only buffer that gets really *** over in a dispelga heavy fight, its not bard. Personally I think Cor is in an amazing place considering how absolutely powerful Leaden is and the fact it gives more unique buffs than Brd. Sure dispels are way more annoying for Cor but can you really complain when your not only an amazing buffer but also an amazing DD.
On the Nyzul note, I think that Geo is actually the best buffer for nyzul style events. These events heavily favor nuking jobs or pet jobs that don't need to go through the animation of drawing a weapon and running up to the mob. Geo can just run around 1 shotting mobs and then when the boss spawns throw out the buffs. Since the normal mobs are so fodder level to begin with you don't need to worry about buffs on those.
By fillerbunny9 2015-09-06 20:33:57
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »How does GEO have no flexibility when they have 2-3 auras up while a COR has two, and are the only buffer with debuffs that really matter like fend, wilt, or malaise?
because of positioning, for starters. GEO cannot buff and then hide in the back lines depending on what they are doing. they may need to be in the fray with a party if they are doing something like Frailty/Fury, Fury/Haste, etc. sure, if you are in a mage party and you need Malaise/Languor and Acumen/Focus you're golden. Entrust is on a 10 minute timer and cannot necessarily be relied upon for the duration of a fight. GEO cannot Pianissimo songs to a mage while simultaneously fully buffing a group of melee. the list goes on, really.
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By Odin.Taberif 2015-09-06 21:07:11
no mention of scherzo? really?
Siren.Barber
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By Siren.Barber 2015-09-06 22:24:35
I don't think people really understand how much of a pain it is for a harp/horn bard when a single dispel goes off.
Before a fight starts you generally put up 4 dummy songs with harp then overwrite with horn. The fight starts. A dispel goes off. So what now? Because the dispel no doubt removed different songs from different people you have to put all four songs back up.
Oh but to put all four songs back up you have to break out the harp again to give non boosted songs. And because you probably don't want herb pastoral equivalents x4 on your melee while you put everything back up its probably best to just put up non boosted versions of the songs you want. But then because the harps duration bonus you have to sit around twiddling your thumbs for a while before overwriting them with horn....during which time you can bet your *** another dispel has gone off.
Basically if anything dispels at all, keeping 4 boosted songs up is all but impossible.
And to be honest its not just the decrease in performance that makes this suck, its the feeling of frustration and helplessness at constantly swimming against the tide. It's just not fun. With GEO if something happens to my luopan I just ring the bell again. With COR there is also some frustration since the COR is often out of dispel range but with gear and JP COR isn't just rolling once per minute anymore. I just flat out won't play bard anymore because trying to keep up four boosted songs is just the opposite of fun.
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By Shiva.Applesmash 2015-09-07 00:28:56
You're really making this seem much harder than it really is.
I can tribox and keep 4 songs up fine, don't see why anyone else couldn't.
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By Damane 2015-09-07 03:10:16
i think the only thign bard needs is some better mage buffs, ballad isnt gonna cut it, some form of mab buff.
thats it
BRD is in a good state. as a buffer COR is the one that needs the most help.
BRD: most flexible buffer > least buff potency
COR: somewhat flesible > more potent potency
GEO: no flexibilty at all > most potent buffs/debuffs.
all buffers have their pros and cons, just because geo is so good now doesnt mean it allways will be. in an environment like nyzul isle for example geo would suck balls compared to BRD when you have to split up pts and move around lol.
cor is the only buffer that gets really *** over in a dispelga heavy fight, its not bard. Personally I think Cor is in an amazing place considering how absolutely powerful Leaden is and the fact it gives more unique buffs than Brd. Sure dispels are way more annoying for Cor but can you really complain when your not only an amazing buffer but also an amazing DD.
On the Nyzul note, I think that Geo is actually the best buffer for nyzul style events. These events heavily favor nuking jobs or pet jobs that don't need to go through the animation of drawing a weapon and running up to the mob. Geo can just run around 1 shotting mobs and then when the boss spawns throw out the buffs. Since the normal mobs are so fodder level to begin with you don't need to worry about buffs on those.
I know what cor is capabable off, hence why i said as a buffer. 20k leaden salutes are delicious and all, but when it comes to buffing in dispel haevy fights cor is kinda *** :/
Asura.Neufko
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By Asura.Neufko 2015-09-07 03:22:44
Every empy weapons can be traded to unlock their weaponskill permanently. Daurdabla should get the same treatment imo, unlocking 3-4 songs on the owner using any instrument.
It would reward daurdabla owners over terpander owners and wouldn't be game breaking at this point in time.
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Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2015-09-07 06:32:50
Every empy weapons can be traded to unlock their weaponskill permanently. Daurdabla should get the same treatment imo, unlocking 3-4 songs on the owner using any instrument.
It would reward daurdabla owners over terpander owners and wouldn't be game breaking at this point in time.
All this would do is save Brds an inventory slot and a few seconds at the beginning of every song cycle when they have to sing dummy songs, to get songs 3/4 up, before they swap to relic horn, or something else to sing the higher potency 4 songs they really want.
I would say give Brds some M.Acc/MAB buff songs , and MDB Down/M.Eva Down Debuff songs. That would help balance them back out with Geos.
Asura.Neufko
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By Asura.Neufko 2015-09-07 08:09:29
You're right about that.
My point was about quality of life in response to barber post.
Magic accuracy or pet enhancing would be more than welcome indeed.
By Armyguy 2015-09-07 20:59:52
Quote: You're really making this seem much harder than it really is.
I can tribox and keep 4 songs up fine, don't see why anyone else couldn't.
Not that its hard. If your triboxing your pt set might be Tank,Healer,BRD. It becomes more of pain when you have Rng and melee DD's, or a 6 man pt. When dispel goes off it doesnt dispel the same buff on everybody and there no way of knowing which buff you have to put back up on everybody.
Quote: BRD: most flexible buffer > least buff potency
COR: somewhat flesible > more potent potency
GEO: no flexibilty at all > most potent buffs/debuffs.
Theres a big difference from Brd att buff then Geo's n Cor's
Brd puts up 4-5 att songs and its not even half of GEO's.
I didnt mean to say brd isnt a main choice but now adays, pretty much any fight a GEO would help more then a BRD. Any good WHM, SCH, BLM manage there mp pools. The New Events for the most part will work but taking a Geo will make the fights go faster and more efficient even with or without BST set-up.
Escha easy win set is DD's x2 or BST x2 make a SC and BLM MB it. GEO buff (Indi-Frailty) + (Magic def down) or (Magic Eva down)+ (MAB)= 5min fight
Sinister Reign easy win set is GEO buffs (Magic def down) or (Magic Eva down)+ (MAB). SCH does SC and BLM MB.
It also be nice if Brd skill did more for the job Where i would want to wear more skill+ gear.
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By Asura.Failaras 2015-09-07 21:12:09
Why does Brd need to compete with Geo? The two synergize extremely well allowing you to use Fury/Frailty on Geo which as you said is extremely potent and use Marchx2 Madrigal on Bard which caps your haste and gives some acc.
By Armyguy 2015-09-07 22:06:32
Quote: Why does Brd need to compete with Geo? It doesnt have to Compete with geo. Using geo to show that Brd's old way of buffing being a Base Number and not a percent like todays Geo, Needs an update. Most Brd Songs cap at lvl 75 naked. When songs should get better with more skill.
[+]
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By Asura.Highwynn 2015-09-07 22:45:10
Arent etudes a gigantic int boost? That's technically their mab buff, considering how much better int is for nukes than it used to be preadoulin.
By Armyguy 2015-09-08 19:57:22
Quote: Arent etudes a gigantic int boost? That's technically their mab buff, considering how much better int is for nukes than it used to be preadoulin.
Wearing 5/5 Fili gear w/ G-horn99 and doing Both Int songs gives +43.
Siren.Akson
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By Siren.Akson 2015-09-10 11:59:58
BRD is in a good state. as a buffer COR is the one that needs the most help. — BRD is easily replaced by a GEO.
I think that was the original point. BRD ain't so vital nowadays.
GEO covers the most important songs a BRD can give and then some.
*Tho BRD is still good on buffs for splitting up/movement.
— GEO does not replace COR.
GEO can not give melee STP nor BST/SMN buffs.
The most important song BRD is left with is Scherzo. GEO cannot duplicate.
So BRD is to negate massive 1 shot dmg taken and... COR is for killing ASAP.
Edit: Oh yeah.... Forgot to mention this.
SAM and Tactian's for BLM also.
How is COR in bad shape again?
Ok guys/girls the problem i think is Brd is still using the old style of playing the needs an update. Im going to post what I think could help Bring back Brd as a main choice.
Im only going to focus on a few songs and show a few examples.
Can make 900 combind skill cap so 450/450.
MINUET:
Attack Buff:
*BRD w/ G-horn99 - Minuet V= +62, Minuet IV=+56 , Minuet III=+48, Minuet II=+32, Songs +5= +17Att
(62+17)+(56+17)+(48+17)+(32+17)=266
COR- Chaos Roll= +3.1-31.2%, Modifier(DRK)=+9.7 Ring+5=+15%
(3.1%-31.2%)+9.7%+15%=27.8%-55.9%
@1000ATK=+278/+559
GEO- Indi-Fury= +31% or 45% withDunna or 59% withIdris
@ 1000 ATK= 310-590
If SE would change BRD's Hard numbers to a percent it would make brd more useable.Examples.
Minute = 2% Minute II=4% Minute III=6% Minute IV=10% Minute V= 14% And each +1 = %1
Minute = +34% no G-horn, Emient Horn+2 = 42%, G-horn=50%, G-horn+Fili=54%
This would make brd have a high att if they choice to use 4songs on Minute.
And most brds wouldnt use all 4 songs on Minute. with 2 songs BRD w/ G-horn @ 39%.
Madrigal-
Are still on point if you use both Songs +45 ACC. W/ G-horn=+71
Pre-Lude-
Is really really good. If anythinig they should make Madrigal buff numbers like this.
Etude
+15 skill> 475skill and each +1 adds about 12sec.
Take the add time away and just give +5stat to fix
Foe Requiem
I know people might yell at me about this BUT. RequiemVII ONLY does 8 damage/TICK but Indi-Poison does 40/tic w/ dunna and 60/tic wit Idris. would it be wrong to ask for it to be buffed. MOBS today have so much HP.
Most worth killing have 1mil+.
Knights Minne
Again this is another song that has Base numbers and +gear makes Duration longer.
Minne V= 120Def ,Minne IV=97Def, Minne III=64, Minne II=41 total= 322 /sigh.
Come on SE how cant you see this.
Again Percent will fix this.
Minne=2%, MinneII=6% MinneIII=11% MinneIV=17% MinneV=24% +gear= 1/1%
w/o g-hron=60% w/g-horn=86%
Indi-Barrier= 60% w/ Dunna and 84% w/ Idris
@1000 def your talking 600-840 def
Also the range mechanic's is broke with Carols II, The Max range is all different.
These arnt hard numbers and it didnt take me long to do this. Im sure you can move numbers around, But the fact is Brd is still living in 75era and needs to be updated.[/CENTER]
Plz comment and add your thoughts. Thankyou
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