Kantonotachi Vs. Masamune, The Great Debate!

With the addition of getting Tachi: Shoha (5/5 Of course), the TP Bonus Kantonotachi appears to be far superior compared to the Masamune (Pre-Afterglow new additions...)
This of course leads me to the question:
Is a Masamune worth getting?

Arguments for Yes:
1.You do not get access to Tachi: Fudo.
2.You do not get access to the Aftermath.
3.You do not have a badass Blue Great Katana.
4.The Damage over time for this weapon would be far superior to the Kantonotachi.

Arguments for No:
1.The TP Bonus for Tachi: Shoha's weaponskills will outshine Masamune's Tachi: Shoha's and possibly Fudo's.
2.Since Samurai's main focus is weaponskills, most of its Damage over time will be coming from Weapon skills and not individual swings.
3.Tachi: Fudo is an obsolete weaponskill compared to Tachi: Shoha (5/5).

These are just some point's that I have come across from asking many Samurai's on Valefor. Maybe FFXIAH could put an end to this debate.

Is the Masamune worth getting or should Samurai's just get the Kantonotachi with TP Bonus on it?

PS: This is just from what I've heard, I do not have either. If there is any information that may be incorrect please correct in the comments to this topic. I did not come across a thread like this in the Samurai threads either, if there is one, please send the link. Thanks~

Masamune. You do still swing alot. Maybe if your doing trash mobs in abyssea, but in voidwatch, fights last a bit, so spammin that shoha with lvl 3 aftermath will outshine that tp bonus anyday. And fudo at 300%, i still crack some 3-4k fudo in voidwatch.

iirc Kantonotachi 99 vs lvl 90 masamune was about 30% better for ws dmg @ 100tp. this is just ws dmg obviously dot/aftermath will close that gap a bit. think final numbers were ~15% better 99 vs 90.

so the question is, does the 99 masamune beat the 99 kantonotachi? i believe it would honestly, with 132 basedmg on the 99 vers compared to the 90 vers which has 114. thats 18 more basedmg and +5 more str.

so for real hardcore sams, i would say yes masamune 99

everyone else, stick with Kantonotachi.

one thing i should mention though, is the possibility to 4hit the Kantonotachi since it has higher delay (464) it's quite hard and i don't even know if you can cap haste yet with it (askar+5 says hi, once it's released) but it is possible.

You make it sound like the aftermath effect affects tachi: shoha damage.

Shoha doesn't give you the ability to self light unless you use kasha. Dmg + str on Masamune is great for the str mod on shoha too. Masamune is easy to get too.

I prefer aftermath hitting for 600 in VW over swingin for 200 lol... SO tp bonus can go away lol...Shoha is a better ws, but compares nothing to the power of aftermath. I still hit 2k+ shoha at 100 tp...Just get a good ws set lol.

doesn't the aftermath suck if you got temps and a cor giving tactitions/miser rolls on you >.>? should be nearly nonstop ws. so...melee swing dmg is kinda of a mute point no?

This just in, aftermath is triple damage.

Dont even bring up the miser/tacts lol...from what all the mega godly peeps on FFXI say, they say tacts is bad!

apparently its chaos roll or fighters roll/misers or your a fail corsair from my understanding... And not all DD have a corsair for themselves in voidwatch lol..so yes, yes you swing.

Don't think you got the point...

You could just make both lol. They can be situational.

Quick little napkin math
TP bonus just beats 99 masamune if you are 2 hitting (WS+1 melee hit) before counting WSs lost to maintain aftermath (I couldn't do this math at all fast as dustywings make this hugely variable) and I also dont know if 99masa got anything new (such as increases fudo dmg, or higher ODD rate). 3hit or higher goes to masamune99

Not sure if it matters or not, but wouldn't the TP bonus GKT have an easier 5-hit build if that matters anymore?

using my above numbers if you are 5hitting w/ tp bonus, and 6 hitting w/ masamune, and tp bonus had they had the same delay (so these numbers skewed in tp bonus's favor)
TP bonus gets 6 WSs and 24 hits=15 348
Masa gets 5 WSs and 25hits=19 345

So, if I'm not being HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE (I might be, probably too late for me to be attempting any sort of math) If you had a 5hit on TP bonus, And simply swapped to a 99masamune (losing a hit to a 6hit hit in the process and changing no other gear) you would actually increase DoT.

.......................

5*437 delay is less than 4*464 how?

Playing aggressively in VWNM(which everyone should), should only spare you 3 landed hits per WS cycle MAXIMUM. Sometimes it can be 2 with overload TP.

How can you not see the balance is pulled towards kantonotachi?

Add:
I probably should elaborate that, given 9 secs since the first TP return of your Shoha (40TP or around there), 6Tp/3sec from Coercion lv15, Monarch only needs 3 tick to accumulate 18 TP. Enhance this further by Miser's or tactician roll, you'll see a lot more possibility to interpret those 3 ticks as 1 landed hit.
Given 53% haste (haste, capped haste on gear, and hasso+2), you should get 3.5 seconds/round.

So it shouldn't take you until landing 3rd hit (worst case: 3 rounds) until you unleash your WS again.

Add meditate into picture, you'll absolutely remove the delay for white damage.

well if you weren't before the "So, if I'm not being retarted" you are for sure after...

you probably should just go ahead and compare 90 Masa to Kantonotachi, as that's what 95% of the population will have

Don't bother with Masamune. Get a Kanto and save time wasted on an inferior weapon.

don't say that too loud now, SE might hear ya and "Balance" Shoha out...lol

Being serious for a moment, SE did say they were looking into tweaking some WS's be it emp/merit ws's who knows, but considering how overbearing Shoha is compared to Fudo SE may/may not put the 2 on their list of changes for the future.

Unless you plan on taking it past Lv90. Fixed that for you.

which a lot wont get the 1500 hm plates
15-20m depending on server prices?

i mean gil is easy to get these days but you can abuse abby for ws trials and blow through them in no time for lv99 kanto


this^^

lv99 Kantonotachi > lv90 Masamune ?

You forgot an extra digit!

Pretty much, if meleeing is required (what I mean by this is if the required x hit you have in gear) and AM3 can be kept up masa Lv90 masa pulls closer but for things like VW 99 kanto all the way.

150-200mil does suck but I think masa will be worth it in the end (Why I'm trying to 95 mine)

No, no no. If you're planning to take masa past level 95, make a *** amano and save 10m+ on plates. Yeh i know this is masa vs kanto but it had to be said. Or even better - save that god knows how much gil's worth in plates and dross/cinder (dunno which masa is) required to hit 99 masa (the only version that mathematically comes close to kanto) and make a Kogarasumaru. Even the 95 version destroys kanto and masa...

Rant aside..

The easier 5 hit is valid. Assuming WS in 17 stp, masamune requires 45 stp in tp set to 5 hit. 47 if WS is in 10 stp.

Compared to this, Kanto needs 28 stp when WSing in 10 stp (rajas, rose strap, brutal), allowing for much greater flexibility in tp set. More DA, more acc (will have substantial returns on top end VW) and the like.

Obviously VW atmacite and misers roll will send those figures up the shitter, but the point stands.

masamune looks cooler, therefore is better, and negates any fact here after.

Orrr make the weapon I want to make because I play SAM because I enjoy it and dont care so much about being the best at everything all the time.

Edit: As long as I beat a certain pesky DRG...


And this!

Masamune doesnt look like a GK Tom Cruise would use so the TP bonus one is better!

Tom Cruise is not cool, why I'm masa4lf! (So glad the -1 button has been taken away >.>)